Brammo Owners Forum
Brammo Enertia Discussion => Brammo Enertia Plus => Topic started by: FrankH on September 30, 2012, 02:17:04 PM
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As you may remember, last August I ordered a black Enertia+ here in the Netherlands. Delivery would be end of August, the Belgian distributor promised. I could not be happier that the long wait was finally over!
I was going the be the first Brammo owner in the Netherlands! I decided not waste anymore money on repairs of my old motorcycle and sold it, because a shiny new Enertia+ would soon replace it.
But sadly, now it's the end of September and the bike is still not delivered. First, according to the Belgium distributor, the Hong Kong Police deal was the explanation, because they were given preference.
The second time around, availability of parts was given as the reason for another delay.
After a third delay, announced last week, until mid-november, my dealer lost faith in the Belgians and cancelled the deal, and will refund my €1000 deposit.
And I'm back at square 1, with no idea when or how I can get my Enertia+. And even though I feel sad and stupid for believing that the wait would come to an end, I still want one, I think.
I hope there will be a happy ending to this story...
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Really sad news indeed!
Dealers losing fate in Brammo is also a bad sign!
I will ask the Brammo guys at Intermot what's going on and will use your example, let's see what their explanation for the delays are...
So looks like Enertia+ in EU in 2012 is becoming 2013? Probably means Empulse will move to 2014 for EU?
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Before I posted this story here, I contacted Brammo sales as well. Thankfully I received a reply pretty quickly from Brammo's director of Marketing, Adrian Stewart. He's going to look into this and apologised for what has happened. He said he'll "contact me tomorrow to confirm when my Enertia Plus will be available". All hope is not lost...
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Well, as always, great service, no bikes... :-\
I know they are positioning themselves for the bulk order market, but all this confusion with delivery dates just makes them look unreliable. If they, or one of their representatives as is the case, promise a product on a certain date, they need to make good on their word. It's better to stop with the promises and just say "I don't know, but soon," than keep frustrating people who are "hearts and souls" trying to make the brand look good. If you don't have a date, don't give a date. All this damage management just sucks valuable time the company could be doing something proactive, instead of reactive.
We are in October now and no sign of pluses and Empulses in the hands of individual consumers. With Zero having all the recalls, electric cars not selling in the US, etc. things are starting to look weird for EVs. The "gasers" are putting out better and more attractive products and the EV market is not responding well. I haven't seen much talk about electrics in the media after the Empuse launching. I can't even find those articles about the Empulse anymore.
Maybe it's time for the EV fans to regroup and re-energize the push for EVs again, before it fades too much. We could also use another Polaris; another big player to announce something big, but seeing the Leaf's and Volt's sales dwindling might not be the best sign for the other big ones to take a stand on EVs (or at least, not one that we would like to see). Of course, it wouldn't hurt to have some people actually riding some Enertias + and some Empulses around... (hint-hint, Brammo; hint-hint ;)) I still think that having some of those in the streets is the best promotion EVs can have. Solid, good-looking machines that can impress the regular consumers. Tic-toc, Brammo.
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As you may remember, last August I ordered a black Enertia+ here in the Netherlands. Delivery would be end of August, the Belgian distributor promised. I could not be happier that the long wait was finally over!
I was going the be the first Brammo owner in the Netherlands! I decided not waste anymore money on repairs of my old motorcycle and sold it, because a shiny new Enertia+ would soon replace it.
Well, same story here (delivery end august), lot of promises but nothing...
At least I have my old CB two-fifty running.
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Honda is bringing back the V-4 sport bike, ala RC30. I may buckle. Not that I can afford either at the moment.
Actually, it sounds like I needs to do another interview with someone from Brammo. I suspect Brian is too busy. But that is just a feeling.
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I spoke to Hans Eder (Head of dealer development Europe) at Intermot yesterday. The earliest date for the plus to arrive is November 15.
EU headquarters is in Germany and they have already a list of orders to fulfil. So no way he could say when the first bike would ship to Holland.
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I wonder what Brammo and Flextronics are doing over there in Hungary. They've had that factory going since July 2011 (http://brammofan.wordpress.com/2011/07/18/introducing-the-hungarian-flexibles/) (about 15 months). Have they been churning out 2012 Enertias? Perhaps they've been building some E+s too, but they are waiting for a certain number before the bikes are shipped. Who can say?
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I wonder what Brammo and Flextronics are doing over there in Hungary.
According to Brammo, they've been building Hong Kong Police Enertia LE's, and after the summer holidays (when apparently they did nothing) they had problems getting production back to speed because of parts availabiltity problems.
Now it seems that the mid-november date is real (meaning no deliveries BEFORE then, no promises made about when they do have bikes available).
Nothing new there.
Brammo keeps saying that they're working on getting my bike into my hands ASAP, but I've heard that before. Still, what are my options? When I switch to a Zero, I guess the closest competitor to the Enertia+ is the XU but I don't really like the looks of that one (although I think I could get used to it). The S is more Empulse territory (and more expensive). And I'm not going to buy a 2012 model now so I'd have to wait anyway. My dealer came back from Intermot with some hope of another way to sell me that bike, through another Dutch company that could become a Brammo importer (but not yet approved). Let's see where this goes in the next few weeks...
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The 2013 Zero FX would be the Enertia Plus alternative with a LOT more power. Just fit some road tires and you're done...
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And thats great! some real competition cant hurt.
Only problem is that brammo, if they continue to delay, continue to break promises and continue to scare away potential customers (european empulse in mid 2013 ?!? zero will then be announcing their 2014 modells soon) might actually go under.
As I still prefer Brammo-styling faaar over Zero-styling (harhar! they didnt realize that while choosing company names, did they? :D) and generally like Brammos "shipping when its done"-attitude Im quite sad to realize that they might loose, or even have already lost the edge.
I do hope they get their stuff together. CHAdeMo integration for the european empulse would be all for now, as well as ABS :)
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As I still prefer Brammo-styling faaar over Zero-styling (harhar! they didnt realize that while choosing company names, did they? :D)
A question I've asked myself many times, although there's not a lot of room to criticize, with a name like "Brammo."
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A question I've asked myself many times, although there's not a lot of room to criticize, with a name like "Brammo."
May you please explain? I have no association than Brammo Inc to that word and cant imagine one.
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Brammo is very close to "Blammo", which is like is a sound effect you might see in comic 1950's books when the Hero punches somebody out of a window. That's probably no coincidence since "Brammo" was Craig Bramscher's nickname when he played American Football.
(http://davephotoyou.com/Blammo/Blammo_logo.gif)
Other than that, it doesn't really mean anything. Over time, Brammo will hopefully give it some pretty cool meaning, but for people who have never heard of the motorcycle company, "Brammo" probably sounds a bit comical.
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A question I've asked myself many times, although there's not a lot of room to criticize, with a name like "Brammo."
May you please explain? I have no association than Brammo Inc to that word and cant imagine one.
Pop culture aficionados associate "Brammo" with similarly named fictional company "Blammo" from the cartoon Ren & Stimpy. Blammo Inc in the cartoon had a product called "log" that was supposed to be a toy for children, but was actually just a log of wood. Here is a sample of the cartoon:
LOG From BLAMMO! on Vimeo (http://vimeo.com/9746957)
Blammo was a play on the name of real toy company "Wham-O" (which also sounds a whole lot like Brammo). Wham-o had an iconic advertising slogan where singers sang "from Wham-O" in a certain way at the end of every ad for any Wham-O product. That slogan still holds plenty of pop culture strength, even though it dates back to the 70's/80's.
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And 64 year old Wham-O got its name from its slingshots which I always envied as a kid with my homemade ones. Now, of course, they make frisbees and hackysacks, and swim fins and boogie boards. Bet the lawyers wouldn't let 'em market slingshots.
Ah, the things we write about whilst waiting and waiting...
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As I recall those Wham-O slingshots were pretty deadly devices. I believe they used steel ball bearings as shot. :o
Another dangerous toy from my early years was the Flexi Flyer. It was a toboggan made for the street. You laid flat, face first, on the hardwood body and the rolled down the street at 20 mph, with only a couple of metal spoons that could be twisted against the front wheels to slow you down. They were great for shooting across an intersection as the cross-traffic whizzed by. Being only about 6 inches off the ground meant that it was only a matter of time before you got stuck under the body of a passing Ford sedan and really went for a ride. Even in those days, it didn't take too long for the public to realize that the herd was being culled a little too fast for that product to stay on the market for more than a couple of years.
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The 2013 Zero FX would be the Enertia Plus alternative with a LOT more power. Just fit some road tires and you're done...
XU 5.7:
* 5.0? kWh, 76/48/59 miles city/hwy 55 mph/combined range
* street styling
* 21 kW
* $10500
Enertia Plus:
* 6.2 kWh, 80 miles city range (guessing ~50 miles 55 mph range, so 80/50/62 city/hwy 55/combined)
* street styling
* 13 kW
* $11000
FX 5.7:
* 5.0? kWh, 70/44/54 miles city/hwy 55 mph/combined range
* dirt styling
* 33 kW
* $12000
By price, styling, power, and range .. the Enertia Plus is closer to the XU than to the FX IMO.
XU 5.7 vs Enertia Plus is an interesting matchup. TBD : )
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I did something like that too once, with an ordinary skateboard. 15m heigh difference in speed, and in the end there was a stone. My mom said my last words before I blacked out were "like a space shuttle" which was, in her eyes, a very accurate description.
Such wonderfull days back then :D
(dont worry, no permamental damage - the scars went away a few years later)
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XU 5.7:
* 5.7 kWh, 76/48/59 miles city/hwy 55 mph/combined range
* street styling
* 21 kW
* $10500
Enertia Plus:
* 6.2 kWh, 80 miles city range (guessing ~50 miles 55 mph range, so 80/50/62 city/hwy 55/combined)
* street styling
* 13 kW
* $11000
By price, styling, power, and range .. the Enertia Plus is closer to the XU than to the FX IMO.
XU 5.7 vs Enertia Plus is an interesting matchup. TBD : )
That's what I was thinking. And thanks for getting back on topic ;)
Top speed of the XU is 124km/h (77mph) which is a lot quicker than the Enertia. And Zero manages to get a lot more kW's out of those batteries.
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Keep in mind that Zero rates their battery pack with maximum capacity. Brammo rates their battery with nominal capacity .. and for the Empulse, both nominal and maximum.
Zero defines maximum capacity to be equal to the maximum battery voltage (upper cutoff for charging) times capacity. the ZF2.7 module is 102V max 28 Ah.. probably 24 * 4.2V. Nominal voltage is closer to the average voltage the battery pack will see near the midpoint SOC, typically 3.7V for lithium-ion (24 * 3.7 = 88.8V).
Speculatively, Zero's ZF5.7 battery pack is 88.8V nominal 56 Ah (4.97 kWh nominal). Enertia Plus is 88.8V nominal 70 Ah (6.22 kWh nominal). Zero's range specifications indicate the XU gets very nearly the same range with a much smaller pack.
Zero allows up to 8C discharge (ZF2.7 2.5 kWh 20 kW motor in XU, ZF5.4 5.0 kWh 40 kW motor in MX). Zero is working the batteries much harder than the Enertia Plus, which are ~2C @ 13 kW.
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".....electric cars not selling in the U.S."
Not exactly the case. They are not selling as of yet as many as they predicted or hoped but Volts (which most owners drive in electric mode most of the time, racking up well over 1 million miles on pure EV mode) have been selling steadily with an increase each month.
The LEAF has not done well yet, but it has been in limited rollout and there has been a lot of negative press about EVs in general and much of it politically motivated and not completely truthful.
The new LEAF plant in the U.S will be producing more in a few months and it will cost less which may entice more customers.
While they are not exactly flying off the showroom floors, they EVs are getting out there more and more. In fact, the Volt is selling more than many gas models.
This is from a story that was done recently.
"With 13,497 sales through August, the Volt is selling faster compared to any other variety of vehicles in the market which includes the Subaru WRX, the Chevrolet Corvette, the Mazda2, and the Nissan Altima Hybrid. The Volt is placed 133rd in ranking ahead of industry stalwarts like the Audi A6, BMW 7-Series, Porsche Cayenne and Mercedes-Benz S-Class, and it has also outsold nearly all hybrids with the inclusion of Toyota Prius plug-in, Kia Optima, Honda Civic, Toyota Highlander and Lexus RX 450h."
Hope this helps put EV sales and adoption in some perspective.