Brammo Owners Forum
General => Brammo News And Views => Topic started by: Brammofan on August 22, 2014, 03:25:48 PM
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Just noticed this new page on the website:
http://www.brammo.com/us-incentives/ (http://www.brammo.com/us-incentives/)
For a limited time, receive incredible end of season discounts including 3.9%* 4.14% APR financing for up to 60 months when you purchase select Brammo models.
Purchase a new 2013 Brammo Empulse for $9995 and receive financing as low as 3.9%* 4.14% APR for up to 60 months.
(Chart here ... see the webpage)
Example: On a purchase where the Amount Financed is $9,995, your Down Payment is $1,500 with 60 monthly payments of $156.99 each. Interest Rate is 3.9% [ANNUAL PERCENTAGE RATE is 4.14% (E)]. A down payment is not required except for marginal credit but will result in a higher payment amount. For other Amounts Financed, the payment would be approximately $18.38 per $1,000 financed.
[“E” means estimate.]
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OMG those prices!
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:o
That's not a limited-time incentive, that's a fire sale. It's limited to the US, but there's a similar price reduction in the ROW (rest of world) here:
http://www.brammo.com/eu-incentives/ (http://www.brammo.com/eu-incentives/)
If you're looking for your nearest Brammo dealer - and you should be - here's a map of dealer locations.
https://mapsengine.google.com/map/edit?mid=zzt5Hf2d_rIk.kEvOcCXhcc_U (https://mapsengine.google.com/map/edit?mid=zzt5Hf2d_rIk.kEvOcCXhcc_U)
Reminds me a little of the Enertia price cut back in 2009, although that was not being pitched as a limited-time offer. Also interesting is Brammo's interest in selling 150k of the 1M EVs Obama wanted to put on the road by 2015.
http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/750/5031/Motorcycle-Article/Brammo-Electric-Motorcycle-Cut-to--7995.aspx (http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/750/5031/Motorcycle-Article/Brammo-Electric-Motorcycle-Cut-to--7995.aspx)
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Sweet sweet sweet deal...I am envious...
G
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IMO this will clear out existing inventory .. and it'll be hard to go back without introducing a radically different product. Maybe we'll see an RR production bike and a shift to a more upscale market.
It's hard to go back to charging $19k for the R after cutting prices by $5k, unless there's a significant change ahead.
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WOAH! 9995 for a new Empulse!? OMG I have to update the TCO calculator! TCO is gonna spank ICEs!
These prices are game changing!
Update: Updated: http://bit.ly/1t18RBX (http://bit.ly/1t18RBX)
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I agree, proto. It reminded me of the Enertia price drop, too. If I could afford a divorce, I'd be all over this.
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Pricing is now inline with what they originally planned to sell them for 10k, 12k, 14k but these all have the bigger battery. Brammo may have decided to raise the price to manage initial sales volumes in case there were any nasty recalls. This would also give them time to expand their dealership network and optimize the supply chain before going full bore on sales.
I hope they are also making room for the RR.
BTW, where has 860 gone? I know he was waiting for a price drop to buy...
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Wow! An Empulse for less than €10.000 including VAT is an amazing deal! (Consumers here only look at prices including VAT)
I can see many commuters doing their calculations again right now.
Regarding timing of this incentive for EU: I think it is perfect timing because they are starting to get some serious dealers now! If they would have done this introduction price in January than nobody could even test ride one. (Although it would have saved me €5k ;D)
Too bad that the riding weather is so horrible over here now. People must test ride these things!
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Pretty much a 30-40% price cut across the board. EU price cuts are a little bit larger even, though only the 2014 bike is available. The 2013 Enertia Plus in the US also got a significant price cut, dropping it below the price of the Enertia Classic.
Pricing in the EU is before VAT, but this brings it very close to pricing parity for comparable gas bikes.
Consider pricing in Germany.
2014 Empulse €7,995 + 19% VAT = €9,514
2014 Triumph Street Triple ABS incl VAT = €8,440
2014 Ducati Monster 696 incl VAT = €8,790
Some thoughts:
1. This will swing many potential buyers that were undecided but serious, and pull forward a lot of purchasing decisions. Great for Brammo in the short term - they'll sell every bike they have already built. The primary goal might be to clear inventory, as I suspect the 2009 Enertia price cuts were intended.
2. Brammo's future sales are going to be hurt, if they simply introduce a 2015 Empulse with small tweaks at the original $16995 / $18995 pricing. Either Brammo will need to institutionalize some portion of the price cuts or introduce a significantly different new product in the future (RR, for example). Maybe a 2015 bike with ABS and 6 kW onboard charging would be sufficiently different.
Consider the price cuts to the original iPhone. Apple introduced (http://arstechnica.com/apple/2007/01/apple-announces-the-iphone-at-macworld/) the iPhone in January 2007 at $499 (4GB) and $599 (8GB), carrier-subsidized pricing. The phone was available in July 2007, and in September 2007 Apple dropped the 4GB model and cut prices (http://arstechnica.com/apple/2007/09/apple-drops-iphone-price-by-nearly-50-percent-early-buyers-not-amused/) on the 8GB model to $399 (again, subsidized).
Early buyers were not pleased - perhaps unreasonably so. Apple quickly extended a $100 credit (http://arstechnica.com/apple/2007/09/early-iphone-adopters-receive-100-credit-from-apple/) to early buyers.
In June 2008 Apple introduced the iPhone 3G (http://arstechnica.com/apple/2008/06/apple-wwdc-keynote-announcements-iphone-2/) at new [subsidized] price points: $199 (8GB) and $299 (16GB).
I'm not sure Brammo can institutionalize the price cuts for the Empulse going forward. I vaguely recall a Brammo employee (who shall remain nameless ;)) saying there wasn't a ton of profit on the Empulse at launch. It's likely that the assembly process has been refined in the ~20 months the Empulse has been on sale, and Brammo may have been able to negotiate better pricing arrangements with its component suppliers. So we'll see.
3. Zero's pricing edge is gone. Even comparing only 2014 bikes, the 2014 Empulse is $11995, below the least expensive Zero S ZF8.5 at $12995. I think this only really matters for markets that are covered by both Brammo dealers and Zero dealers, and I think Zero has generally done a good job moving their 2014 bikes to this point. Zero may have to respond with a similar price cut to continue selling their 2014 bikes.
4. I want one :x
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I'm happy my purchase got delayed. I'm getting this deal now! It's getting delivered on Tuesday. It's worth the 2 week delay now!
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I can't think of a reason why Brammo would lower their prices to such an extent. I can't recall any motor vehicle company offering such an MSRP discount for any current or leftover model over the past 52 years of being a motorcycle customer.
I am really looking forward to see what follows this announcement. Personally, I don't think Zero will cut their prices (they never have before, to my recollection). However, they may just stop making 2014 models and hope that Brammo runs out of product quickly and doesn't make those prices similar for the 2015 bikes. If they had to match those prices, I think their private investors would bail out. There is no way they could make a profit by selling Zeros at those prices. Plus, their dealers (many who are not all that happy about selling Zeros, anyway) will be throwing a fit if they get stuck with the bikes and can't move them off the floor. I believe that Zero makes their dealers buy the bikes from the factory before they are shipped to the showroom.
I emailed my Zero dealer with the sale information and asked if they had any comment. None yet.
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I'm curious to know how many they are actually going to sell at this price. Let say they sell 30-40 bikes at this price. That's only like a 200K loss (maybe), that's not bad for an advertising budget to get more people out there seeing and talking about their bikes. Just seems like a black Friday kind of sale to raise awareness.
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Great news for littlefreak!
G
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Perhaps the reason that Brammo is having a big sale is that the prices of their bikes next year will be lower than this year. :) According to this article by Clean Rider the cost of lithium batteries is dropping rapidly and we all know that will have a huge effect on all EV prices. That is good news for everyone in the EV industry, especially consumers:
http://cleanrider.com/price-lithium-batteries-declining-faster-expected/ (http://cleanrider.com/price-lithium-batteries-declining-faster-expected/)
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Am I the only half empty guy here? I am not too happy about what this will do to the implied resell value of my existing bike at all.
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Am I the only half empty guy here? I am not too happy about what this will do to the implied resell value of my existing bike at all.
The glass was always half empty. You just didn't realize it until now. The only way to get your value out of an electric vehicle is to put many many miles on it.
It's an astonishing development, and my first thought was that this is not the kind of move that a healthy company would make. But then, as others have pointed out, this is a field in which the most expensive component -- the battery -- is rapidly becoming more cost effective. If that's the root cause, then you would expect a rising tide to raise all boats (or something like that), in which case Zero should also be able to drop their prices.
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Am I the only half empty guy here? I am not too happy about what this will do to the implied resell value of my existing bike at all.
The glass was always half empty. You just didn't realize it until now. The only way to get your value out of an electric vehicle is to put many many miles on it.
It's an astonishing development, and my first thought was that this is not the kind of move that a healthy company would make. But then, as others have pointed out, this is a field in which the most expensive component -- the battery -- is rapidly becoming more cost effective. If that's the root cause, then you would expect a rising tide to raise all boats (or something like that), in which case Zero should also be able to drop their prices.
This is just a clearance sale to get rid of old inventory to make room for the new bikes. We knew that as early adaptors we were paying a premium for being the first ones to get our hands on a really great bike. I'm ok with it... We also knew that at some point the prices would come down. One thing is for certain, I'm definitely getting my money's worth.
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We knew that as early adaptors we were paying a premium for being the first ones to get our hands on a really great bike. I'm ok with it... We also knew that at some point the prices would come down. One thing is for certain, I'm definitely getting my money's worth.
That's the right way to look at it. It's a big purchase, so you want to feel good about it. "Early adopters" are making a financial sacrifice to help advance a worthwhile technology. I was all in for that idea when I bought my Empulse.
A price drop like this is not such a surprise, it just came a little sooner than expected. I would be more upset if technology made a huge leap forward with, say, a year of my purchase, which in my case is not going to happen.
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This sort of pricing dynamic around EV's is why a lot of people advise leasing vs. purchase.
Me? I just ride and grin!
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I have this new good paying job and there's a 2010 VFR1200F demo bike with 1600 miles on it going for $12,000, that is perfect for getting me to races states away, if not on the other side of the country. It's the sensible choice. And now Brammo does this to me!? There aren't enough sleeping pills on this ship to let me sleep tonight. arrggggghhhhh. :o
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I have this new good paying job and there's a 2010 VFR1200F demo bike with 1600 miles on it going for $12,000, that is perfect for getting me to races states away, if not on the other side of the country. It's the sensible choice. And now Brammo does this to me!? There aren't enough sleeping pills on this ship to let me sleep tonight. arrggggghhhhh. :o
But which bike will get you to, and from your new job, reliably (and in style) for next to nothing in fuel costs?
I would find a new 2013 Empulse locally if possible or somewhere in the country and have it shipped. Save 2k and spend that (and the money you save in fuel) towards something used that will get you where you need to go for races. :)
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Having just purchased an Enertia Plus at the beginning of July, I feel that I paid full price when a major discount was in the Brammo pipeline. Especially disappointing after discussing this very matter with a company representative.
That being said, I am having a blast on the bike and enjoying every mile!
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I have this new good paying job and there's a 2010 VFR1200F demo bike with 1600 miles on it going for $12,000, that is perfect for getting me to races states away, if not on the other side of the country. It's the sensible choice. And now Brammo does this to me!? There aren't enough sleeping pills on this ship to let me sleep tonight. arrggggghhhhh. :o
But which bike will get you to, and from your new job, reliably (and in style) for next to nothing in fuel costs?
I would find a new 2013 Empulse locally if possible or somewhere in the country and have it shipped. Save 2k and spend that (and the money you save in fuel) towards something used that will get you where you need to go for races. :)
I work on a ship for 35 days straight and fly to work. If, we start sailing in the Gulf again and I have to go to Houston where the company is based out of, the VFR is still the right choice. If I taught music locally, the Empulse would be the choice. But the bicycle shop I still work at part time is only 4 miles from my new place with a bike lane or "route" all the way there. And the grocery store is only a mile away. The logical choices for those two places is the bicycle. Gonna feel stupid to fire up a 1200cc sport tourer just to go 4 miles, but I have the little 500 for that. I think I might actually get it put back together this time home. And then I ask myself if I do more good for elmotos by owning one or by going to the races to cover them and spread the word.
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So this price drop is a big deal for the entire motorcycle industry... why have no news outlets picked this up yet?
I sent in a tip here a few days ago:
http://www.engadget.com/about/tips/ (http://www.engadget.com/about/tips/)
No response yet.
Perhaps it would help if others sent in a news tip. :)
I would really like to see what people think about this in the comments. Last time there was a Brammo article on Engadget, most complained about price and range. Obviously price (and IMO range) is no longer an issue.
UPDATE:
Article just popped up on ABG:
http://green.autoblog.com/2014/08/27/brammo-offers-massive-price-drop-on-electric-motorcycles/ (http://green.autoblog.com/2014/08/27/brammo-offers-massive-price-drop-on-electric-motorcycles/)
Domenick is on top of things as usual :)
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It dropped on autoblog green because I tweeted it at them this morning.
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BTW, where has 860 gone? I know he was waiting for a price drop to buy...
Just saw the ABG story, so I'll be calling the dealership in the morning to see what they've got. $5000 off is pretty darn close to the (up to) $6,000 dollar tax incentive that Colorado was originally going to offer, so it puts the price much closer in line with what I originally was planning on spending before Colorado killed the incentive for electric motorcycles.
I'd actually resigned myself to the idea that I would have to wait and buy used after Brammo came out with a updated model, and the prices on the old bikes dropped in the used market. But this might just work out better than waiting and buying used. Hopefully they will have something that will work for me.
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BTW, where has 860 gone? I know he was waiting for a price drop to buy...
Just saw the ABG story, so I'll be calling the dealership in the morning to see what they've got. $5000 off is pretty darn close to the (up to) $6,000 dollar tax incentive that Colorado was originally going to offer, so it puts the price much closer in line with what I originally was planning on spending before Colorado killed the incentive for electric motorcycles.
I'd actually resigned myself to the idea that I would have to wait and buy used after Brammo came out with a updated model, and the prices on the old bikes dropped in the used market. But this might just work out better than waiting and buying used. Hopefully they will have something that will work for me.
Im pretty sure that Foothills had a Red and a White Empulse last time I was there, which was like two weeks ago. Not sure what year though, but I think 2013. They are great people there, hopefully they can hook you up.
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Im pretty sure that Foothills had a Red and a White Empulse last time I was there, which was like two weeks ago. Not sure what year though, but I think 2013. They are great people there, hopefully they can hook you up.
The red one is sold, and headed for Oklahoma. The white 2013 was still available when I was there, but somebody else was there talking about Brammo's while I was there. The white one is the one they've been using for demo rides, and shows signs of having been laid down (road rash on the right passenger peg, and a bit of damage on the "tank" cover, etc), so I'm on the fence on it. They were going to call and check on what they could order in.
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Both the tank cover and the peg are easily replaceable. Easy to change to another color while you're at it. They could throw in the cost of those two parts too.
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The speculation continues: http://insideevs.com/brammo-fire-sale-story-behind-story/ (http://insideevs.com/brammo-fire-sale-story-behind-story/)
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The speculation continues: http://insideevs.com/brammo-fire-sale-story-behind-story/ (http://insideevs.com/brammo-fire-sale-story-behind-story/)
While I appreciate Polaris's marketing capabilities, I don't hold them in very high regard when it comes to products. They just don't make very good products when compared to others in their segments. But don't tell that to any Polaris true believer. The article points towards Brammo focusing on supplying parts, and Polaris is the obvious partner. Of course I think Polaris's investment into Brammo was a wise one, in any case.
I am definitely torn on the speculations in the article. I really, really want Brammo to continue producing their own motorcycles. IMO, electric motorcycles are inevitable. The question is whether the company can hold on and maintain marketshare long enough to still be there when the market blows up. Zero is coming up with pretty good products - which is why you have purchased two, I'm sure! I hope Zero isn't scaring Brammo out of the market. I don't want Brammo to go the supplier route like Mission.
Craig obviously has business savvy. The quick dollar is to become a supplier. I hope the long term vision of owning the electric motorcycle industry is still clear in everyone's mind in Talent. Please don't sell out to Polaris!
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My thought is that there is a good chance that Brammo motorcycles will be sold by Polaris dealers next year, perhaps with a modified brand name. This would explain the interest in clearing out the pipeline this year. I could see Polaris taking over the marketing and manufacturing of Brammo motorcycles, with Brammo doing the R&D and producing the batteries for them. It makes (business) sense to me. With Polaris's deep pockets and stature in the market, they could likely easily negotiate for lower component prices and be able to drop the prices of future models by thousands of dollars. :)
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My guess is that the next bike will not have a gearbox. Perhaps some RR type version. It would be hard to move the old models if none of the new Brammo bike line up used a gearbox. No gearbox might allow the service interval to be increased to 7.5K or more, which is a good thing when you only have 13 U.S. dealers (per Brammo website). Maybe add wireless firmware update; iphone interface; 6K charger; ABS :).
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I had a look at the exhibitors list of the Intermot tradeshow and Brammo is listed.
Maybe they will introduce the 2015 model line there?
Intermot is from 1-5 October
I will be there on the 4th
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Did anyone happen to notice this press release quote from Polaris in the article that I referenced yesterday:
Under Homan’s leadership, the Global Adjacent Markets business will have responsibility for all Small Vehicles product lines, including GEM, Goupil, Aixam/Mega and Brammo, as well as all commercial, Brutus, government and B2B applications of Off-Road Vehicles (ORV), Snow and Motorcycles outside Polaris’ traditional dealer channels. Homan’s team will also have responsibility for all merger and acquisition activity related to adjacent markets. Polaris’ Defense product line will report financial results through the Global Adjacent Markets business, but continue to operate as a separate business line.
And now we have this report that states (or surmises, it is becoming hard to know what is fact and what is speculation, anymore) that Brammo is dumping product this year in order to improve their sales numbers prior to an IPO next year:
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094120_brammo-electric-motorcycle-prices-cut-by-5000-to-7000 (http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094120_brammo-electric-motorcycle-prices-cut-by-5000-to-7000)
My vote is that Polaris will take over the manufacture, marketing and sales of Brammo electric motorcycles and the Brammo company will become the R&D consultant to Polaris and other EV firms, while Craig goes off in a corner of Brammo to develop a new electric sports car.
I am not buying the IPO idea. I just don't think it will sell on the stock market right now. ??? But then what do I know? I get most of my information from watching TV news and reading my local newspaper. :o
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So they are clearing inventory by selling at a huge discount, but that raises the question... Are they still manufacturing 2014 Empulse / Enertia? If a dealer sells out of 2014s, can they order more from Brammo or is Brammo retooling for 2015 models?
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I haven't a clue about Brammo, but Zero tends to close down their assembly line around now and starts spending a lot of time fooling around with the 2015 prototype bikes to see how they work before ordering the parts that they need for next year's models. This of course assumes that sales have slowed down (very likely) and dealers are no longer ordering bikes due to the approaching winter season. Or that some "sugar daddy" hasn't ordered a big batch of bikes like Bogota did (a 100-bike sale) at the end of the 2012 model year.
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Did anyone happen to notice this press release quote from Polaris in the article that I referenced yesterday:
Under Homan’s leadership, the Global Adjacent Markets business will have responsibility for all Small Vehicles product lines, including GEM, Goupil, Aixam/Mega and Brammo, as well as all commercial, Brutus, government and B2B applications of Off-Road Vehicles (ORV), Snow and Motorcycles outside Polaris’ traditional dealer channels. Homan’s team will also have responsibility for all merger and acquisition activity related to adjacent markets. Polaris’ Defense product line will report financial results through the Global Adjacent Markets business, but continue to operate as a separate business line.
And now we have this report that states (or surmises, it is becoming hard to know what is fact and what is speculation, anymore) that Brammo is dumping product this year in order to improve their sales numbers prior to an IPO next year:
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094120_brammo-electric-motorcycle-prices-cut-by-5000-to-7000 (http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094120_brammo-electric-motorcycle-prices-cut-by-5000-to-7000)
My vote is that Polaris will take over the manufacture, marketing and sales of Brammo electric motorcycles and the Brammo company will become the R&D consultant to Polaris and other EV firms, while Craig goes off in a corner of Brammo to develop a new electric sports car.
I am not buying the IPO idea. I just don't think it will sell on the stock market right now. ??? But then what do I know? I get most of my information from watching TV news and reading my local newspaper. :o
Hmm, well a story I heard when Brammo and Polaris first put their deal together was that Polaris wanted to buy Brammo out right, but Brammo wouldn't sell. I am wondering if that language is a reflection of the past or sign for the future.
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Yeah, that Green Car reports article makes sense. I know they had been planning to go public sometime soon. It's also pretty obvious the writer has been reading his thread.
That whole thing does put a hole in my "way better bike next year" theory. If they are simply trying to pump numbers to sell stock to raise money to develop newer bikes then maybe the 2015 Brammo's will be just like the 2014's. Simple improvements that don't agitate the owners of the previous model year.
Or, if I make up a silver lining maybe the IPO will co-inside with the release of a new badass model, so twice the reason to sell off the leftover stock at cost. Hey, it could happen. ;)
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Btw, the author of the GreenCarReports article does read these threads, but got his information from a source who is close to the company.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Wasn't suggesting otherwise.
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No offense taken, just clarifying. :)
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The Dutch importer has the discounted Empulse E1 as 'Sold Out' (Uitverkocht) on his website.
Seems that stock is running out!
www.electricmotorcycles.nl/producten/5/brammo-empulse-introductiekorting-kopen
Hurry up and get yourself an Empulse R while you still can!!!
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Hurry up and get yourself an Empulse R while you still can!!!
A beautiful black Empulse R was sold at HD Downtown in Duiven Holland yesterday:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ByT7IpxIYAEMqIj.jpg) (http://pic.twitter.com/jt2QOS2JI8)