B40 fault B8 system fault

[new-brammo-guy]

Korbin, can you post the complete log data from your bike so we can see if the humidity increased in Module 7 when the heaters in Module 7 were used? The file will be too big, but a Google Drive link should work.

[Korbin Dallas]

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1iKmkmtWcihqi72xtO4FTXpPFclJVfaXu?usp=sharing

warning 1.78 GIG
I will also post the altered file I made with just the last year or so.

[Korbin Dallas]

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/189TIxt-Od_p4EpjjzjQGObLIIH27g2dW?usp=sharing

Altered file way smaller

[Korbin Dallas]

found the biggest problem with the battery under module 5 circuit board
pictures posted.

[new-brammo-guy]

See attached plot of data from Module 7 only. Blue is the Relative Humidity (%) and red is when the heater was activated (mA).

There are some jumps in the humidity over time - we should take a closer look to see what's causing it. But doesn't seem related to the M7 heater (unless I'm missing something).

[Korbin Dallas]

I love the graph versus filtering thru the excel spreadsheet. Is the spike in humidity around july 19 2022 at 7:47?

[new-brammo-guy]

The jumps in humidity in Module 7 seem to occur after the bike had sat a while. The attached plot shows humidity again (blue) along with the number of days the bike sat between rides (green).

These jumps in humidity between rides could have been caused by:

[1] A difference in ambient climate / season between the on/off as the bike sat (I guess, I don't totally know how humidity is being measured)
and/or
[2] The cell(s) in Module 7 were slowing leaking over time and the humidity was being built up from the leaking chemicals over time. The larger the time between rides (on/off), the more humidity would have been built up. 

Korbin, each module is separated - right? So humidity in one module would be isolated from another?

[new-brammo-guy]

I think there are two issues here that may or may not be related:

Issue #1: Humidity in Module 7
Possible cause: Cell leaking electrolyte slowly over time. Was the leak caused by a manufacturing defect of the cell or something else (e.g. heater, wiring, etc.)?
Notes: This may have not caused the bike to go into B40. In fact, if the B40 was not triggered, the bike might have eventually caught on fire like this post: https://brammoforum.com/index.php?topic=4243.0 (it'd be good to look at justinmkantor). Note that the humidity has been building up slowly over time.

Issue #2: Module 5 PCBA Temperature (C) and Battery Min. Temperature (C) which are both wacky.
Possible cause: Random failure of the components? Seems unlikely but this could be checked by Korbin.
Notes: This issue is likely what caused the actual B40 fault and but completely unrelated to the humidity increases. As others have noted, the humidity may have accelerated the M5 sensor failures, though not if the modules are isolated. The temperature sensor failures appeared suddenly, unlike the humidity increases.

Korbin, could you please check the Module 5 PCBA Temp sensor with a multi-meter? I don't know where it's at - trying to find it with your images.

[new-brammo-guy]

Here's your pic of Module 5 PCB. EV Promise thought the humidity and temp are "U14". Maybe someone else knows the component to look for and could circle it using the attached image.

Once you find it, you could compare the multi-meter measurements of the sensor on Module 5 with another module.

[Korbin Dallas]

The modules are not isolated completely. 5,6,7 are in the same case. Please see the latest pics I posted of the pcb#5 the under side is toast. I will be tearing the rest of the module down to see the bad cells

[new-brammo-guy]

Wow. OK, I update my theories listed above to include that a chemical leak from the cells caused:
[1] A slow and steady increase in humidity in modules 5, 6 and 7 over time (though highest in Module 7)
[2] Eventually killed the temp sensors - or something like that - in Module 5.

Korbin, does it look like all of the chemicals leaked from Module 7 or other cells too (Module 5 and/or 6)?

[Korbin Dallas]

I think we had two problems   Module 7 had the high humidity and faulted but may have been caused by the chemical leak in module 5. The chemicals pooled up in the top of the case (bottom because it is upside down) and was probably really close to the humidity sensor of module 7. I will know more soon as I am going to completely disassemble modules 5 and probably 6. I hope someone else can tear down a B40 fault battery and confirm our findings.

[new-brammo-guy]

That makes sense. Battery chemicals leaked from Module 5 (and maybe others) but pooled in Module 7 (where we see the highest humidity).

The temp fault came from the  PCB on Module 5 that had the chemicals drip on it and damage its temp sensor(s). Or just cause a bunch of damage to the PCB that made it behave oddly (which is what we kinda see in the data)

[EV promise]

Hi, can you clean the electrolyte off the back of the board with warm soapy water and a toothbrush. Then let it dry. Board are coated so only the test points may be shorted. Have to see what you find.
Also I think I can see your boards are REV 01 etched into the back in a photo. Made for Victory with different data connections.
Modules are 4s10p instead of 9p, so more powerful than Brammo ones, hence the different layout.
Also I think the humidity sensor is a Honeywell HIH 4030-001.

[Korbin Dallas]

New photos posted of circuit board after warm bubble bath with a loofah scrub.