Brammo Owners Forum
Brammo Empulse Discussion => Brammo Empulse Mods => Topic started by: BrammoBrian on December 14, 2013, 02:20:53 PM
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I always get ansy in the winter when I can't ride and the race season is over, so I start thinking about ways to modify my bike. I worked on my Ducati a few winters ago, my BMW S1KRR last winter, so now it's time to mess around with my Empulse R. I realize that most are pretty pleased with the off-the-line acceleration from the stock gearing, but I'm going to try a 42 tooth on the rear to see what I get. I kind-of already know, because that was one of the first mods done to the TTX bike for racing and resulted in this video...
Empulse TTX Power Wheelie. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0SiMi3oujE#)
I'll let you know how it goes if we can get a couple of days of decent riding weather.
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Cool! I was thinking of playing around with the rear sprocket when it comes time to change out the chain, probably in another 20K miles, since I have 11K on her now.
With the 42, how hard is it to accelerate to the max and NOT pop a wheelie by shifting the body weight forward? I love me some hole shot power, but I don't like constant wheelies. Mostly I'm interested in making 6th gear more useful to me on the freeways, as well as nudging the motor's rpm's up into a more efficient zone when traveling slowly around the city in 1st gear, especially climbing hills slowly in San Francisco.
Of the top of my head (or outta my a**) I was considering going to a 40T for just an incremental change. But if 42T can be fitted without affecting the chain line under the chain guard and over the chain alignment plastic add-on goodie, and if I can easily control the wheelie capability, I'll try the larger sprocket.
Looking forward to your report, weather permitting.
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I'd be curious as to what happens to top speed with the bigger sprockets.
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Any chance that it will affect the accuracy of the speedometer?
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It should not as we use a rear wheel speed sensor. We can't use motor rpm to gauge vehicle speed as we do on the Enertia as the Empulse is not direct drive.
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After my interview with Jeff I've been curious about the opposite. He told me how the 0-30 was there the Empulse R was fast. I wonder if a (slightly?) taller gear might help keep the bike in 1st gear longer and improve the 0-60 time while sacrificing the 0-30 time.
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Welp, I'll let you all know myself! Thanks Brian for continuing to insert terrible ideas into my head.
I picked up one of these (http://sprocketcenter.com/index.php/street-sprocket-applications/aftermarket-wheel-sprockets/marchesini/superlite-92611l-520-black-heat-treated-steel-rear-sprocket-race-wheels.html) and one of these (http://sprocketcenter.com/index.php/motorcycle-chains/sportbike-chains/520-pitch/d-i-d-520erv3-heavy-duty-gold-x-ring-race-chain.html).
(note: if you want to do this, the Empulse chain is absurdly short. The shortest size they sold (96) was plenty long)
(http://i.imgur.com/3ovNBGw.jpg)
Goodbye old chain, you fulfilled your duty well (and probably would've lasted PLENTY longer)
(http://i.imgur.com/Yg6nU4Z.jpg)
HellOOOOOOOO sexy!
(http://i.imgur.com/0bPhrhE.jpg)
Aw yiss. The sprocket actually appears to be every so slightly kind of an olive drab? Looks nice, whatever.
In any case, I think I solved California's drought problem: as soon I as install a badass rear sprocket, we actually get rain for the first time in months. It's gravely needed, so I ain't gonna complain, but hahaha I am going to wait to try out any wheelie madness. Will definitely report back!
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Lol. Install looks great! Can't wait for it to dry out and give us a report!
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You call THAT rain??
Anyway, it's dry today and we NEED that report! (But no pressure).
Nice-looking bits you found: wouldn't expect anything less from you!
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Oops... I guess I forgot to comment on this change on my bike.
The good:
It definitely makes a difference on acceleration. It pulls hard enough in sport mode to lift the front tire for about 10 feet off the line. Stock gearing provides 882Nm at the rear wheel in 1st gear, this change will put you at 975Nm (720 lb-ft)! 8)
You can find yourself at 90+ mph very quickly. I'm not sure the difference versus stock gearing, but it feels much quicker.
The bad:
You have to shift through 1-2-3 very quickly. You can hit 60mph in 2nd, but you've got to over-rev the motor a little bit past peak power.
It makes a steady throttle hand a necessity when exiting slow speed corners or in wet conditions.
It also makes the regen feel stronger. I'm not a big fan of the regen level in Sport mode, so this kind of bugs me. Good thing I can have it turned down though... ;)
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Thanks Brian for continuing to insert terrible ideas into my head.
I knew I was good for something... ;)
Nice chain selection BTW.
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It also makes the regen feel stronger. I'm not a big fan of the regen level in Sport mode, so this kind of bugs me. Good thing I can have it turned down though... ;)
whoop sneaky 6pt font post! Can I make a request for selectable regen modes please!
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I have a way to remove all regen...park at work for 9 hours in 30 degree weather and presto, no regen for the ride home :)
Only works in winter...
G
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I have a way to remove all regen...park at work for 9 hours in 30 degree weather and presto, no regen for the ride home :)
Only works in winter...
G
Lol. I'll see how that works as it heats up here in Dallas!
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FYI... you can find the Empulse in the gearing commander database now...
http://www.gearingcommander.com/ (http://www.gearingcommander.com/)
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It also makes the regen feel stronger. I'm not a big fan of the regen level in Sport mode, so this kind of bugs me.
OTOH, I'm a huge fan of the Sport mode regen curve: works perfectly on the hills of San Francisco and in making 90 degree turns from boulevard speeds. If I ever find it too aggressive, all I have to do is modulate it with easing back with my right wrist. It's become second nature to dial in just what I need for any situation.
Having the ability to change regen (etc.) from a smart phone app sounds pretty cool, however.
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It also makes the regen feel stronger. I'm not a big fan of the regen level in Sport mode, so this kind of bugs me. Good thing I can have it turned down though... ;)
I've been thinking about this for a good while now. I've arrived at the conclusion that:
- On the street, I love the Sport regen mode. The 42T even moreso. I love not having to use the brakes, and I love shrieking up to stoplights in full regen and causing all the
ladies' nerds' heads to swivel. - On the track, however, I have come to dislike the regen. I'm pretty sure that in a track context, if I'm not on the throttle, I should be braking. There should not be any instance of 'coasting' going on. In addition, the batteries get too toasty after a few laps anyways and the regen turns itself off, so I all of a sudden have to adjust for no regen in the middle of a lap (or corner!).
I find myself wishing that instead of toggling between Sport and Normal, I could toggle between Sport and Sport With No Regen. I basically never use Normal anyway, and seem to get nearly identical range out of it the few times I have.
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Brammo can probably reprogram the modes for you. It'd be nice to be able to tune the modes as on the Zero bikes.
Since the clutch is almost vestigial, even on the Empulse, I think a left lever to control regen (squeeze lever to reduce or turn "off" regen, just like a clutch) would be interesting.
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Thanks Brian and Jeff for planting all these corrupting ideas in my head. ;)
Since Brian likes Jeff's chain choice, I ordered it today, along with the steel sprocket Jeff chose. I also got a chain-breaking kit for when the times comes.
I've never researched sprockets before (had shaft drive bikes) and wowza! is that subject open to controversy and marketing hype! I'm more interested in longevity of my drive train than weight-saving racing considerations. So...Ironman, Sidewinder, Superlite, Chain Gang, Sunstar, etc.
* What steel rear sprocket brand do people deem the longest lasting? (Link?)
* What front sprocket seems to be the longest lasting? (Link?)
I purchased some Fuji locking style nuts with sprocket from Sprocket Center, but couldn't find any bolts, since they said the one bolt kit they offered was for off-road bikes only. Do the studs in the Marchesini wheels not get replaced with the sprockets?
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Lots of good info here gang. Thanks for continuing to plant mod ideas in my head.
I'm giving the 42T a go as well. Same setup as Jeff. I may give the 40T a try after riding the 42T around.
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Well I've got all my components: chain and two sprockets and chain alignment tool, and then I measured my chain.
At 12K miles, it's measuring pretty much like new! Guess that Dupont Teflon chain lube sprayt stuff really works.
I'm just too stingy to change it all out without a sufficient mechanical reason.
I'll just have to pin the throttle more often. ;D
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I'm just too stingy to change it all out without a sufficient mechanical reason.
I'll just have to pin the throttle more often. ;D
You can come visit me in Oregon and drive on the neighborhood dirt road. That will reduce the life of your chain. Currently my Empulse is in the shop getting its front bearings replaced after 6000 miles.
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Just to add to Jeff's post...
1) I removed 9 links from my 96 link chain to add the 42T. Stock is 86 links.
2) Sprocket torque to rim is 25ft-lbs. This wasn't in the manual and I didn't see it mentioned. Thought that would be helpful.
Haven't tried it out yet...hoping to give it a go tomorrow.
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barboo needs to move to New Mexico so I can bug him to do mods on my ride :)
G
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barboo needs to move to New Mexico so I can bug him to do mods on my ride :)
G
I would love NM, Gavin. Getting a little tired of the cold in Indiana. :)
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2) Sprocket torque to rim is 25ft-lbs. This wasn't in the manual and I didn't see it mentioned. Thought that would be helpful.
Thanks, barboo.
That's a 17 mm wrench and 34 Nm added to my garage wall torque spreadsheet. (attached)
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Although my chain wear isn't excessive (about half way to the limit), at 15K miles the OEM chain had developed 3 stiff links, so I decided to do the install.
I also changed out the rear brake pads, since I had the wheel off anyway. They had a little less than 1 mm remaining. BTW, the spec on them was somewhat difficult to find at my dealer, but they turned out to be Galfer FD220's.
After riding the new setup for a week, I've decided I do prefer most aspects of the 42T ratio. I like the sharp braking, especially when going down the steep San Francisco hills. I like the slightly increased RPM when motoring around the city at slower speeds. And it is a good feeling to finally use 6th gear on the freeway. Blasting away from stoplights on occasion is a bit more thrilling as well. I don't think I'll go back to 38T. (See my other post about an automatic oiler mod.)
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Although my chain wear isn't excessive (about half way to the limit), at 15K miles the OEM chain had developed 3 stiff links, so I decided to do the install.
I also changed out the rear brake pads, since I had the wheel off anyway. They had a little less than 1 mm remaining. BTW, the spec on them was somewhat difficult to find at my dealer, but they turned out to be Galfer FD220's.
After riding the new setup for a week, I've decided I do prefer most aspects of the 42T ratio. I like the sharp braking, especially when going down the steep San Francisco hills. I like the slightly increased RPM when motoring around the city at slower speeds. And it is a good feeling to finally use 6th gear on the freeway. Blasting away from stoplights on occasion is a bit more thrilling as well. I don't think I'll go back to 40T. (See my other post about an automatic oiler mod.)
Cool! I also like how the regen does a nice decel buzz when slowing down at stoplights. Catches folks attention and makes them wonder what you're riding. :)
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Cool! I also like how the regen does a nice decel buzz when slowing down at stoplights. Catches folks attention and makes them wonder what you're riding. :)
Catching pedestrian attention is also very important to me. The decel whine is not very loud, but it IS unusual enough to capture some attention and just may serve to trim down the sad number of deaths per year in San Francisco: 20 in 2013.
Recently in the SF Bay Area, we had a young girl die while listening to her music with earbuds AND texting. What killed her, without her foreknowledge, was a freakin' railroad train! I'm sure she was in her own little world and now she's in another world.
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I picked up one of these (http://sprocketcenter.com/index.php/street-sprocket-applications/aftermarket-wheel-sprockets/marchesini/superlite-92611l-520-black-heat-treated-steel-rear-sprocket-race-wheels.html) and one of these (http://sprocketcenter.com/index.php/motorcycle-chains/sportbike-chains/520-pitch/d-i-d-520erv3-heavy-duty-gold-x-ring-race-chain.html).
It looks like I need to replace the chain now at 14k miles. I have seen the links to rear sprocket and
chain that people have used (Thank you for posting). Anyone know what front sprocket to use? I know
the current one is 14 tooth for a 520 chain.
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I just had my local dealer order one from Brammo. They were reasonably priced and saved me from doing research.
They ARE still supporting the bike in parts: just ordered steering head bearings from them.
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I found this article very informative and the chart inside the article extremely helpful when I need new sprockets.
http://www.bikebandit.com/community/guides/how-to-choose-motorcycle-sprockets (http://www.bikebandit.com/community/guides/how-to-choose-motorcycle-sprockets)
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Has anyone tried to fit a larger than stock front sprocket?
My chain hits the swing arm near the rear sprocket so increasing it may solve that. I could go up to 44 on the rear to keep the ratio.
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Chain hits near the rear sprocket??
Do you have the part installed as shown in the fourth picture down on post #63 in this thread:
http://brammoforum.com/index.php?topic=1848.msg15653#msg15653 (http://brammoforum.com/index.php?topic=1848.msg15653#msg15653)
This spacer solved all my chain hitting swingarm issues and should be available through the dealer.
If you DO have this part and the chain is still hitting, I'd have to guess that your chain is way too loose.
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Thanks for that link.
I don't have this on my bike and my dealer advised to tighten the chain but that doesn't help.
I will point him to this same link and I hope he can still order this.