Brammo Owners Forum
Brammo Empulse Discussion => Brammo Empulse => Topic started by: flar on February 28, 2013, 05:52:21 AM
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I feel like someone handed these editors an Empulse without any information on how to use the transmission. I don't have a copy on hand, but Richard230 posted some interesting quotes from it over on the emoto forums:
http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=2729.0 (http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=2729.0)
I replied there trying to correct much of their misinformation (dumping the clutch on an electric motorcycle? Seriously? Using 3rd in the city?). Feel free to head over there and put in a couple cents, but I think letters to City Bike pointing out the mistaken assumptions would be better. Unfortunately, a decent Letter would require reading the full review and they don't publish the current issue anywhere but on paper around here in the Bay Area (that I'm aware of)...
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It takes all types of people to make up the world, I guess. Negative reviews are to be expected from time to time as the opinions about motorcycles are as numerous as the number of riders.
The discussion over on elmoto.net is full of arrogant bloviating, as per usual. Not going to even link it here. I used to enjoy posting over there before it became a Brammo-bashing insult-fest.
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Again I haven't read the review:
But, reading the parts written in the other thread, I wouldn't say it was an overly negative review...more an overly cautious review.
Maybe next month they can ride with Shinyside and get a proper test of the bike. :)
Still, as a fanboy, I'll take Motorcycle of the Year in Playboy and an overly cautious review in this paper vs the opposite....
Gavin
as for elmoto...i wonder how they responded to the Playboy article...i was going to say Playboy spread, but thought better of it....
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ps...great reply Flar...I am learning so much here about riding the Empulse...I will be a master with my first throttle twist :)
Gavin
There should be a "Proper way to ride an Empulse" thread that Brammo can show to all the review people before they ride one.
And customers too
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I don't think anyone posted the playboy news there. Be my guest.
I think elmoto is more of a home for diy builders at this point. Zero owners seem to have adopted electricmotorcycleforum.com as their go to the forum and other diyers collect on endlesssphere.com too.
I'm just glad that this remains the fortress of solitude for Brammo owners.
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I think elmoto is more of a home for diy builders at this point. Zero owners seem to have adopted electricmotorcycleforum.com as their go to the forum and other diyers collect on endlesssphere.com too.
I'm just glad that this remains the fortress of solitude for Brammo owners.
Agreed. I really appreciate the opinions and constructive debate that takes place on this forum. I noticed the attempts to recover the conversation over on the elmoto forum, but I'm afraid that they are too far gone... we must leave them behind to slave in their garages and curse every idea that is not their own. It was obvious that the better the Empulse turned out to be, the more angry they would become. So... I'm glad they're pissed.
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I think elmoto is more of a home for diy builders at this point. Zero owners seem to have adopted electricmotorcycleforum.com as their go to the forum and other diyers collect on endlesssphere.com too.
I'm just glad that this remains the fortress of solitude for Brammo owners.
Agreed. I really appreciate the opinions and constructive debate that takes place on this forum. I noticed the attempts to recover the conversation over on the elmoto forum, but I'm afraid that they are too far gone... we must leave them behind to slave in their garages and curse every idea that is not their own. It was obvious that the better the Empulse turned out to be, the more angry they would become. So... I'm glad they're pissed.
I do not really appreciate this post. No not everyone is a fan of every idea or is civil about it over on El Moto. I'm sorry you have had a bad experience. Yes disdain has been focused towards Brammo by many on El Moto. And yes Brammo has delivered a revolutionary bike that I (4yr+ member of El Moto) would like to own one day. But what right does that give you to dismiss all of us on El Moto with a single post such as this. Please do not let one bad person or experience or motorcycle review let you become prejudice of an entire community
I'm not sure I want to purchase a Brammo bike ever now. I would speculate that many want more respect than this post from their motorcycle manufacturer. However the statement one person shouldn't be enough for me to dismiss an entire brand when that brand shares a common passion with me.
I apologize if I have detracted from the original topic of this thread
-Kyle Ginaven
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It's tough...I know both Brammo and Brian himself have been treated "poorly" over there.
For a while I said I would never buy a Zero because their lead designer came here under a pseudonym and said some things....but that would be counter productive for me if Zero made the best bike for me...
I appreciate that Brian uses his own name, even if he can be a bit gruff at times...
He is a bit protective of "his" bike...
And welcome to the forum...love your user name
Gavin
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...No not everyone is a fan of every idea or is civil about it over on El Moto. I'm sorry you have had a bad experience. Yes disdain has been focused towards Brammo by many on El Moto. And yes Brammo has delivered a revolutionary bike that I (4yr+ member of El Moto) would like to own one day. But what right does that give you to dismiss all of us on El Moto with a single post such as this. Please do not let one bad person or experience or motorcycle review let you become prejudice of an entire community
I'm not sure I want to purchase a Brammo bike ever now. I would speculate that many want more respect than this post from their motorcycle manufacturer. ...
I apologize if I have detracted from the original topic of this thread
-Kyle Ginaven
Kyle,
Welcome to the forum. About the post from Brian, I totally understand his frustration and emphasize with him. It's hard to fault some one fighting against a negative mob mentality to express a little happiness when he gets to say "I told you so" about a product that he is passionate about. I actually respect the company more for standing by their product passionate against false claims.
Look at how much Elon Musk vented at the NYT false article. Makes me want to see the company succeed even more. Like I said, make me understand Brian's comment and really makes the response trivial to the amount of bashing received.
Welcome to the forum and I hope you get to enjoy this bike. I haven't riding a bike since I was a kid and never had a street bike. This is really my first and it's been a treat.
Bob
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Thanks for the welcome guys.
There is probably a lot of the situation with forum members and Brian that I don't know anything about. I think the link to Elon NYT situation is a good comparison. So I want to apologize to Brian as he meant nothing personal to me and I hope he doesn't take my comment too personal. I am also very appreciative to Brian for taking the time and effort to post some inside perspective into Brammo design. Brian's work has improved the ideas and designs of my builds. As you stated Brian should be proud of his bike. I have to admit that the Empulse has been a big motivator for my R6 conversion as a performance metric (upgrading to AC at the moment).
Just had to defend our El Moto honor a little I guess haha
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It's cool. Protecting a site you like is honorable.
Glad to have you here...
Now about that conversion...photos? :)
Gavin
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Please show your bike. Despite having a tesla roadster and the brammo I have no idea about building and the tech about electric bikes! Please share!
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Double post
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Welcome, Kyle. I appreciate your honest expression of your feelings and considering the viewpoint of those who feel differently. The strident tone in political expression is all too much with us these days. I can be "for" something without be an "adversary."
I took exception to all the folks over on elmoto opining about the transmission without ever riding one. Much theory, much defending a position, much name calling. (I got called a FanBoy which I took as a compliment since I'm pushing 70!).
As I posted over there today: A mentor once told me: "Men want to be always right. Right. Right. Dead right." Me, I'd rather go for a nice ride, which I just completed on my Empulse. Fun bike and I just wish the lads over at City Bike had taken just a bit more time to educate themselves.
Would love to see your conversion. If you're in the Bay Area, maybe we'll swap for a ride when you're done?
Bill
2013 Empulse
2010 TMax (auto transmission!)
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Does anyone here need to sit on the "Group W" bench. ;)
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Nuts, if you listened to my interview with Frodus then you know I've been on that forum since almost the beginning. I started my blog and podcast for a reason, and that reason was because I could no longer stand the vitriol on elmoto any longer. There used to be a lot of what I thought was fun debate over elmoto racing that I stirred up, as well as builds and everything else. At the time not many people had the money for builds, but as we have seen more and more people have been actually building bikes. But, Ted wanted it to be only about builds and PM'd me into submission. Add to that Mechanic, who has said things that make me certain he is anything but, and you double the vitriol and I decided to make my own corner and if anyone wanted listen then cool (and then it became a small little monster of its own).
Obviously most of the people on the elmoto forum are good people, as is why I have started venturing over there again. But I find the atmosphere to be mostly toxic. I set mechanic off with my comment. My frustration is that Brammo has stated sooo many times on why they use a 6-speed transmission that it is infuriating when publications make it obvious they haven't bothered to pay attention to the very thing they are writing about. However, the comment I made was not from anything Brammo said, but a few years ago a few article were written about transmissions and electric motorcycles, and one of them I am pretty sure was James Parker. Anyway, the jist was a 2 or 3 speed just wasn't viable. I would have loved to have replied but the thread just went off the deep end, and I prefer to not feed the trolls.
As for hanging out here, I am very grateful they haven't thrown me out yet. And actually grateful they let me hang out at all.
Edit: Found it! http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/750/10144/Motorcycle-Article/Brammo-Shifts-Gears.aspx (http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/750/10144/Motorcycle-Article/Brammo-Shifts-Gears.aspx) Parker didn't write it but is quoted.
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Say what you will about some of the people that post on elmoto, but they are certainly putting in a lot of thought and effort to express their ideas and opinions, going on over there under this topic. I can understand how someone that thinks all the time about how to build their next electric motorcycle might really want to kick the idea of a transmission around - especially as it is most likely very difficult for a DIY'er to build an electric motorcycle with a transmission and get it to work. So, obviously, you would want to debunk the idea so that you wouldn't feel like you were building a second-class EV by not going with a gearbox. I think that anyone that is building their own bike, wants to see it look and perform as well as possible and at a cost that they can afford. Using anything but a direct-drive is unlikely to be practical for a DIT'er.
Personally I still prefer direct-drive as I am not looking for class-leading acceleration or high top speeds. I just want a motorcycle that gets me down the road as far as possible and at a speed that is safe. Having fewer things to maintain and a lighter weight is also a plus for me. But I am certainly interested in how the transmission will work in practice and I am very happy that the electric motorcycle consumer has a clear choice of the two different design concepts.
There is a lot of interesting comments going on at elmoto right now. The "flames" have subsided quite a bit and I think thoughtful reasoning has prevailed.
http://www.elmoto.net/showthread.php?2835-City-bike-reviews-the-Empulse-R/page5 (http://www.elmoto.net/showthread.php?2835-City-bike-reviews-the-Empulse-R/page5)
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Please show your bike. Despite having a tesla roadster and the brammo I have no idea about building and the tech about electric bikes! Please share!
Since you asked :D My build thread is here http://www.elmoto.net/showthread.php?1906-Nutshock-V2-0-Electric-R6-Build (http://www.elmoto.net/showthread.php?1906-Nutshock-V2-0-Electric-R6-Build) Don't want to clutter up the Brammo Forum so I'll keep my updates over there.
Most pictures are located here
http://s194.beta.photobucket.com/user/buckboom00/library/Electric%20R6 (http://s194.beta.photobucket.com/user/buckboom00/library/Electric%20R6)
-Kyle