San Fran peeps....

[protomech]

All of the body panels are painted with an automotive grade paint and clear coat. The colors will not yellow in sunlight.  They also have a very subtle, but nice (IMHO) pearlescence or shimmer to them in real life, even the black.  The finish is top notch. Even the matte black parts are painted for a more even, durable, and better aesthetic finish deserving of a $18k bike.

One of my chief complaints about my Zero - it doesn't feel like a $14k bike. The 2013s are reportedly a step up in fit & finish, but I doubt it's close.

Where have you been recently?  The Empulse has a very noticeable amount of off-throttle regen or "engine braking".  You can trail brake and rail the bike into a corner harder than most gas bikes I've ridden.  Definitely harder than a Triumph Street Triple R.  Having ridden multiple bikes to benchmark the performance of the Empulse and Empulse R, I don't think the new Ninja 300 would stand a chance.  Sounds like we need to film some shoot-out videos... sweet!;)

I'd love to see some comparison videos.

[protomech]

There is a drawback to racing electric bikes and that is the lack of engine braking. ICE bikes will be able to come into the corners faster and brake later than the Empulse...especially a lighter bike. Coming out of the corners onto the straightaway is where Empulse should do well. The Empulse specs indicate it would go head to head with the new Ninja 300. The 300 should be able to pass the Empulse coming into corners using later braking, but the Empulse should then regain the lead coming out of the corner using higher torque. Then on the straightaway they should be equal.  

Ninja 300? NO WAY. The Empulse is more in the class of the Ninja 650 in terms of performance.

2012 Ninja 650:
Claimed HP: 72HP
Claimed Torque: 47.2 lbs/ft
Curb Weight: 461 lbs

Empulse:
Claimed HP: 54HP
Claimed Torque: 46.5 lbs/ft
Curb Weight: 470 lbs

Power delivery is much more linear on the Empulse. I would put money on the Empulse in the twisties against the 650. Another advantage of the Empulse, at least here in Colorado, zero performance loss due to thinner air.

In the twisties? Yeah, I don't doubt the Empulse would walk handily away.

Ninja 650: 0-60 3.99s, 124 mph top speed (per MCN pdf).
Ninja 300: 0-60 ~6s, 105 mph GPS top speed (various online forums)

If the Empulse is truly limited to 100 mph, then either the cooling system is pretty disappointing and it can hold 40 kW for only a short time, or it's RPM limited in sixth gear at 100 mph. Shinysideup indicated 1st gear was good for 60 mph .. that's a very narrow spread for gearing.

I would be surprised if a little more than 100 mph wasn't available.

[Vibetrippin]

I was under the impression that all the advertising was for 100+ MPH. I guess I had been thinking that was a figure thrown deliberately low so that the 400lbs guys don't get mad when the bike only does 80 uphill with them on it.

Also, it's pretty easy to limit top speed on an electric vehicle while still having the capability to go a lot faster. eg. P510  FLA = X-10%

[Gavin]

BrammoBrian, you do know that we will be asking every other day for these videos....ok...everyday...ok...probably a few times a day...





Gavin

[AJ Nin]

I doubt Brammo will be too quick to put a stock Empulse r in competition with either the stock Ninja 650r, the Ninja 300, or any other ICE bikes for that matter. Personally, between an Empulse r and a Ninja 250r (both stock), I would put my money on the Ninja....until proven otherwise. Comeon Brammo, you have to walk the walk.

[EmpulseRider]

I doubt Brammo will be too quick to put a stock Empulse r in competition with either the stock Ninja 650r, the Ninja 300, or any other ICE bikes for that matter. Personally, between an Empulse r and a Ninja 250r (both stock), I would put my money on the Ninja....until proven otherwise. Comeon Brammo, you have to walk the walk.

Wow, now you're saying the 250R would best the Empulse... Hmm, not sure where you are coming from considering the available reviews from Wes Siler among others, and the spec sheet for each bike, but we can always agree to disagree.  

[Deadly Silent Ninja]

Wow, now you're saying the 250R would best the Empulse... Hmm, not sure where you are coming from considering the available reviews from Wes Siler among others, and the spec sheet for each bike, but we can always agree to disagree.  

No! No agreeing to disagree! I'm with Gavin on this one: we want videos! We want videos!

C'mon! Nothing will make a better statement for electrics than having an Empulse leaving some ICEs behind. I would say "smoke them," but that's ICE talk. Maybe just zap them...

[Richard230]

I owned a 2003 250 Ninja for several years, before I gave it to my daughter who still has it.  Compared with my 2012 Zero it is much faster off the line, especially if you spin the motor up before releasing the clutch, but would get left in the dust during a 5th or 6th gear roll-on between 40 and 70 mph, in my opinion. The Ninja makes pretty good power for its size, but you really have to spin it between 8K and 12K rpm to get that power. With the Zero, the power is there instantly with just a twist of the throttle.

[Deadly Silent Ninja]

Huh... There is a "Brammovangelist" under my nickname...  
Do I get a free Empulse, too?  

Yeah... right... you need to be on the list to get prizes...  

Well, whenever anyone gets interested in getting the new, new Empulse and wants to get rid of their old one... you know where to find me.

[protomech]

Personally, between an Empulse r and a Ninja 250r (both stock), I would put my money on the Ninja....until proven otherwise. Comeon Brammo, you have to walk the walk.

What kind of a wager is it if you have to see the proof first? : )

@ DSN: Brammovangelist is just a title based on postcount. Note that if you sort the brammoforum by post count, you get this:

Brammofan, 2054    posts // Brammovangelist v1.0, given an Enertia
Gavin, 1898 posts // Brammovangelist v2.0alpha, loaned Enertia and then Enertia Plus test bike
protomech, 1169 posts // bought a Zero, burn the heretic!
Richard230, 825 posts // bought a Zero, burn the heretic!
EmpulseBuyer, 641 posts // Brammovangelist v2.0, given an Empulse R

This is more correlation than causation, but FreepZ is next up on the list..

[Deadly Silent Ninja]

Yeah, I know. I just thought you get the moniker after 500 posts.
... and asking for free stuff, especially an $18k electric motorcycle that can kick some ninja's butt,  is never wasted effort. 

We still need those videos... That would make for a nice winter posting. A series we can call "Empulse versus ICE."

Every week someone would post a clip of an Empulse against some ICE bike. And we all should get a piece of the action against AJ Nin. Even I, know a Ninja 250 can't beat the Empulse. The new Ninja 300 would have a significant weight advantage, while having significantly more power than the 250R. But I am still on the Empulse side on this one. It's when we get to the 600s and 650s that things get competitive. Therefore, we need videos.

I would suggest these shoot outs just to get us warmed before things get serious:

Empulse v. Ninja 250R
Empulse v. Honda 250R
Empulse v. Ninja 300
Empulse v. BMW F650 GS
Empulse v. Suzuki GS500F
Empulse v. Ducati Monster 696
Empulse v. Yamaha FZ6R
Empulse v. Harley Davidson Sportster 883
Empulse v. Triumph Bonneville
Empulse v. Kawasaki Ninja 650

All of them are entry-level bikes and should be good tests for the Empulse.

 

[860]

All of the body panels are painted with an automotive grade paint and clear coat. The colors will not yellow in sunlight.  They also have a very subtle, but nice (IMHO) pearlescence or shimmer to them in real life, even the black.  The finish is top notch. Even the matte black parts are painted for a more even, durable, and better aesthetic finish deserving of a $18k bike.

The seat on the white and black Empulse and Empulse R have a small grey insert at the back on the side of the "passenger" portion of the seat.  The red Empulse and Empulse R have this panel in a very nicely matched red.  For the record, our "red" is much more of a red/orange and quite vibrant in real life.  The red you'll find on Ducatis and Hondas tend to be more of a crimson or "blood" red.

That's awesome news for me.  Thanks for the info.  I should have known Brammo wouldn't cut any corners.

I'm definitely looking forward to seeing all 3 colors in person.

[Shinysideup]

I owned a 2003 250 Ninja for several years, before I gave it to my daughter who still has it.  Compared with my 2012 Zero it is much faster off the line, especially if you spin the motor up before releasing the clutch, but would get left in the dust during a 5th or 6th gear roll-on between 40 and 70 mph, in my opinion. The Ninja makes pretty good power for its size, but you really have to spin it between 8K and 12K rpm to get that power. With the Zero, the power is there instantly with just a twist of the throttle.

And with all due respect, having just ridden the Empulse R as well as the 2012 Zero a couple of months back, the Empulse off the line is WAY ahead of the Zero. Haven't ridden a Ninja 250 but I'd put my wagers on the the Empulse after Steve Atlas judged it to be comparable to a 650 twin, which, by the seat of my very much less educated pants, felt about right.

And the summation of all of our suppositions here pretty much misses the operative point which you bring up in your last sentence: the way cool thrill of these bikes is the instant availability of their torque delivered to the rear tire pretty much any place in the RPM range. It's really a gas, or whatever the electron equivalent of that term is. (It's an amp?)

While, the Zero's computer throttle mapping seriously dampens back the that torque for the first 10 mph or so, the Empulse lets things fly much more so. Being thrown down the road with almost no noise, no matter what your moto's rpm is doing, is very much of a rush, beyond what figures on a stopwatch can tell us. At least that's my experience and the cause of my shelling out some cash for one of these puppies. Oh, yeah, and the paint's nice too.

[BrammoBrian]

One thing that I think always gets overlooked is the accessiblity of the performance of these bikes.  Let's take for example a normal sportbike encounter... the stoplight drag race.  If you're planning on launching your Ducati Panigale off the stoplight at near its maximum acceleration, you'll need to get your timing just right... revs way up (everyone staring at you now)... wait for the light... wait... wait... then perfect finesse of clutch release and throttle application... too much and the bike wheelies, too little and it bogs and everyone laughs at you for making such a ruckus.  Meanwhile, our hero on the Empulse simply waits for the light to turn green, twists the throttle and acheives the optimal launch, every time, over and over and over... while the Panigale owner botches it 9 times out of ten.  While the Empulse may not compete with a Ducati Panigale in "on-paper" acceleration, my experience tells me that in the real world, the performance the bike does have is far more accessible to the everyday rider.  This is what I believe you're hearing about in the rider's real world reviews.  It's not imagined, the bike IS faster more of the time, in more conditions, for more people...

[Gavin]

The things I find appealing about the Empulse...sitting at a light, clutch out and not stalling...crazy...twist and go easy with a shifty attitude.

And city riding...I don't know it I would do this or not...but the ability to just put the bike in second gear and not shift at all...it is really the best world of single gear and shifty. Stuck in traffic? Just put it in 1st or 2nd and never touch the clutch...hitting the mountain twisties? Highway driving? Shift away.

As much as I love the Enertia Plus, the Empulse is very tempting.  In the city ease of the Plus, but a two seater AND the ability to shift...seems like a real Win Win.

Nice job Brammo...now make a ton of them...fast

Gavin