Author Topic: Enertia Plus version 2.  (Read 4211 times)

Gavin

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2010, 02:45:17 PM »

Not sure why you still think the fan is coming in during normal city driving, unless you consider 45mph+ as "city".


Going by Kelly's observations

Quote
I don't have an Enertia, but I've been around many of them and the fan has been on all the time the bike was on regardless of day or night or if they had been driven a long or short distance. The fan was always on. And this was on four different Enertias.

And most of my riding is under 40mph, but yes Albuquerque has many city streets that are 45 mph, and some (Tramway, Coors, Paseo del Norte) that are 50-55mph...and that doesn't include I-40 and 1-25 that bisect the city and are used as city roads (65mph).

Still I hope the bikes Kelly has heard have just been going WOT and are not the norm.

Gavin
« Last Edit: October 27, 2010, 02:58:45 PM by Gavin »

Kelly Olsen

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2010, 05:15:07 PM »
Lowering the seat height for women won't work for me at 6 feet four inches. I think that they have lowered the seat on the Plus. Not certain but it looks like it from the pictures. The first Enertia was at a perfect height for me. This new one looks like I'm going to be bending my legs a bit more. Might have to build up the seat or ride on a phone book.

Better in my opinion, because it would be cheaper than a shaft drive, would be a carbon fiber belt with NO maintenance. You just hose it off, plus it is quiet. Now that would be a real improvement. Get a quieter fan or get rid of it all together with liquid cooling and use a carbon belt (and make a way to put on trunk the back) and you have the perfect Enertia in my book.

But I still happily ordered the Plus as it is and will make some changes when I get it.

HighlanderMWC

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #17 on: October 27, 2010, 06:05:11 PM »
And most of my riding is under 40mph, but yes Albuquerque has many city streets that are 45 mph, and some (Tramway, Coors, Paseo del Norte) that are 50-55mph...and that doesn't include I-40 and 1-25 that bisect the city and are used as city roads (65mph).

Still I hope the bikes Kelly has heard have just been going WOT and are not the norm.

Gavin

I don't know exactly what Kelly is seeing - perhaps Enertias that are charging? The fan comes on while charging and is quite loud in that scenario.

To me city riding is more typically 25-35mph with lots of stop and go. If you are spending significant time over 40mph then I'd think the likelihood of the fan coming on to be quite high, especially if you're in 80F weather. Of course if you're doing 40+mph you can't hear it as much, but it will be quite annoying when you slow down (although still quieter than the car next to you).

Kelly Olsen

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2010, 02:07:47 AM »
I was not mistaking bikes with a cord coming out leading to a wall plug and being charged. The experiences I was talking about was with bikes that were on the street or in a parking lot with a rider on them unconnected to anything other than a human rear end ;)

The bikes were all in the non-charging mode and had a rider that just pulled up and stopped. Some had gone a long distance to get to where I was and some were just ridden around the block. Just an observation, not a scientific, blind study. I'm certain others may have different experiences, especially people that actually own them. Maybe I just hit the fan jackpot each time I have been around one.

But I'm still getting one and will live with the fan.

Gavin

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2010, 07:55:20 AM »
.

But I'm still getting one and will live with the fan.

+1

Heck, I've never even seen an Enertia in person and I'm still getting one...now that's crazy :)

Gavin

Kelly Olsen

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2010, 04:49:44 PM »

"Heck, I've never even seen an Enertia in person and I'm still getting one...now that's crazy"

Well, there are people that get put into arranged marriages and they have never met each other so at least you've seen videos and pictures and have heard other people talk about your future partner and what she's like.

BrammoBrian

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #21 on: October 28, 2010, 10:56:38 PM »
I'll try to hit a few of these from memory...

Seat height - It's the same as the Enertia.  There is a change to the ergos, though, as the handlebar is about 1" further back towards the rider and just slightly higher.  This new position has been preferred in side-by-side comparison and riding tests for tall and short riders. 

Brake position - No chance of a left hand master cylinder.  We're going to stick with motorcycle standard controls as described by the FMVSS (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards) unless we start building a scooter.

O-ring Chain - You have spoken and we have listened.  O-ring chain will be standard on Enertia Plus.

Radiator vs. Fan - A water cooling system simply adds too much cost to the bike, unfortunately.  The motor is more expensive with the added water jacketing, a custom aluminum radiator is expensive, a small, reliable 12V water pump is expensive, and the added bracketry and assembly cost all add up as well. 

Top Speed - stay tuned...  ;) FYI... hardly anyone's noticed that we've bumped the battery bus voltage up to 88.8V nominal vs. the Enertia's 76.8V. 

Keep the input coming.  Very helpful! 


Gavin

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2010, 11:08:46 PM »
Thanks Brian...great stuff and why Brammo has my faith...great communication is a wonder in today's world.

I'm fine with the height and with the brakes...was thinking more of what BrammoCraig was asking about getting new riders...but again, the brammo scooter could address that...lower seat with scooter/bicycle type brakes etc etc.  The nice potential of an electric scooter is the chance to keep the batteries low...giving a low center of gravity and great balance.

O ring, yea...top speed possibly higher, yea...keeping costs down, yea...

I'm "cool" with air-cooling....I have one ride air-cooled, one water-cooled. Perhaps a small change to the fan itself...coming from the computer world I know fans can come in wildly different noise levels.

Of course I haven't heard the fan noise myself...so I could be a bit off...but quiet is a good goal no matter what.

Again, thanks.

Gavin
« Last Edit: October 28, 2010, 11:18:36 PM by Gavin »

protomech

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #23 on: October 29, 2010, 12:50:41 AM »
O-ring Chain - You have spoken and we have listened.  O-ring chain will be standard on Enertia Plus.

Fantastic. Someone go ask Honda (say) to change their selected chain, see how far that gets you ..

Quote
Top Speed - stay tuned...  ;) FYI... hardly anyone's noticed that we've bumped the battery bus voltage up to 88.8V nominal vs. the Enertia's 76.8V.

*cough*

Higher voltage should rev higher, higher amps should rev harder. Up to limits of the motor and the  controller.

Any idea when we should see journalist Enertia Plus tests?
« Last Edit: October 29, 2010, 07:11:38 AM by protomech »
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webman

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #24 on: October 29, 2010, 12:57:40 AM »
I'll try to hit a few of these from memory...

Seat height - It's the same as the Enertia.  There is a change to the ergos, though, as the handlebar is about 1" further back towards the rider and just slightly higher.  This new position has been preferred in side-by-side comparison and riding tests for tall and short riders. 


Brake position - No chance of a left hand master cylinder.  We're going to stick with motorcycle standard controls as described by the FMVSS (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards) unless we start building a scooter.

Music to my ears!  I'd hate to see a non-standard setup turning away crossover ICE-bike riders.

O-ring Chain - You have spoken and we have listened.  O-ring chain will be standard on Enertia Plus.

+1!  Fantastic news.  Much lower maintenance, longer lasting, too.

Radiator vs. Fan - A water cooling system simply adds too much cost to the bike, unfortunately.  The motor is more expensive with the added water jacketing, a custom aluminum radiator is expensive, a small, reliable 12V water pump is expensive, and the added bracketry and assembly cost all add up as well. 

Top Speed - stay tuned...  ;) FYI... hardly anyone's noticed that we've bumped the battery bus voltage up to 88.8V nominal vs. the Enertia's 76.8V. 

HMMM!  You've got my attention!

Keep the input coming.  Very helpful! 



Nice job on making the turning radius tighter, and with the amazing speed with which you've increased the range.  Keep up the good work, Brian and co!

eric
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webman, aka eric

brammo vehicle desired:  Empulse 8.0
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'06 honda metro (wife's bike, mostly)
previous bikes:
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'84 Honda VF750 Interceptor

Kelly Olsen

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #25 on: October 29, 2010, 04:58:53 AM »
Thanks Brian for the clarifications and new information.

Good to know that the seat height is the same and also about the handle bars coming back a bit. That sounds like a good improvement because I was thinking that if I could sit up just a tad more I would be in a more comfortable position and this change seems like it will fix that for me.

Pretty incredible company when the designers make changes to the product based on telepathy. And the O-Ring decision really shows that you are listening to feedback, even if the information was sent in a rather primitive form of communication; the internet. God is that out dated compared to my brain wave transmission powers.


Gavin

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #26 on: November 18, 2011, 01:14:13 AM »
Brake position - No chance of a left hand master cylinder.  We're going to stick with motorcycle standard controls as described by the FMVSS (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards) unless we start building a scooter.
Keep the input coming.  Very helpful! 



Old thread...and I know Brian is anti brake where the clutch is...and he is the designer...but....

KTMs new electric dirt bike...lt hand is the rear brake...like bicycles...like twist and go scooters...



Either is fine...I can easily brake with my rt foot...I do know my left hand reached a few times for either a clutch or a brake...

Gavin

BrammoBrian

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #27 on: January 06, 2012, 12:25:56 AM »
A sneak peak at the Enertia Plus battery pack...



A brilliant work of art (and technology) IMHO.  You're looking at 6.2kWh of Enertia propelling goodness right there.  

More trivia:

- The Enertia Plus battery module (1 of the 2 pieces that make the "pack") is internally referred to as the "BPM 44/70" = Brammo Power Module 44Vdc (nominal) / 70Ah

- The Enertia Plus battery pack has exactly half the number of cells of the Empulse RR race bike that won last year's TTXGP championship.  

- There is no EV battery pack in production today that boasts a higher specific energy that that of the Brammo BPM 44/70.  Automotive EV industry included. 
« Last Edit: January 06, 2012, 12:29:41 AM by BrammoBrian »

Gavin

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #28 on: January 06, 2012, 01:05:48 AM »
Yeah....thanks for breaking the photos here...we really appreciate Brammo coming here and sharing...

Thanks

Gavin

Gavin

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Re: Enertia Plus version 2.
« Reply #29 on: January 06, 2012, 01:11:06 AM »
Mmm, 2 packs vs the 6 in the Enertia classic...extra space left over in the plus? And will the Enertia 2012 (non plus) have just one module? So even more extra space?

Mmmmmm, I gather the main body compartment is radically changed from the 2009 model....


Any chance of throwing a third module in as an add on modification?

Gavin