B40 error tackling

[Haplo]

Hi all, Bert here,

I joined the forum yesterday and introduced myself and my Brammo in another topic. With this topic I hope to find some help to tackle the B40 error on my Brammo..

Short history: since purchase frequently the B9 error popped up. Usually after something like 10 minutes riding it disappeared. At 1 or 2 occasions the B40 error popped up, but after switching ignition (can you speak of ignition with an EV??) off/on I was able to continue my journey without any more issues. Last week the B40 error popped up after riding for 30 seconds. I again restarted, but after doing that several times it was clear the error popped up constantly after 30 seconds. Prior to those 30 seconds I was able to ride normally. I was glad I was able to limb home..

I tried charging the bike, but to no avail. The Brammo keeps giving B40 after 30 seconds. The first few days trying I was still able to engage the engine in those first 30 seconds, but now it also doesn't engage any more.

Yestrday I started disassembling it but found no real issues yet. I have heard of corroded cables, or connections, but almost everthing looks very nice and clean. The only connections I found which were dirty and wet were the CAN-Bus connections on the battery's. I disconnectied all of the connections I could reach to see if cleaning those would result in a easy repair. Unfortunately, no luck.

When I look at the information the Brammo gives me, some things catches the eye: the min/max voltage of the cells seem very good to my inexperienced eye: Max 3.985 Min 3.941. However the temperature seems odd. -24degrees... See attached pic.. Also I looked at the LED's of each module. They blink kinda weird. A lot of green flashes, but also occasionally red. Looks like an error code, but there does not seem to be a constant flashing order. I made a video.. see: https://youtube.com/shorts/PIOCQMePJf0

I already have read a lot of topics here about the B40 error. My summarization of all that info is: the BMS is in idle mode. The BMS info is transfered through the CAN-bus which is mounted on circuit boards inside the battery modules. Battery Module 5 is most prone to give malfunctions since its one of the 3 lower modules and mounted upside down. Here fluids (from battery pouches or water) can get pile up and damage the PCB.

My questions:
What are the flashing LED's on the battery modules showing?
Can the -24 temperature reading be a result of a faulty PCB of one of the modules?
Can the -24 temperature reading cause the B40 error?
If above no questions are 'yes' does this give hope by fixing the issue to simply fixing the faulty temperature sensor? Or should I see this B40 error more like smoke-screen where all sorts of things happen but cannot be trusted?
Last question: if things go south i'm not reluctant to start replacing cell's or the complete battery modules. I read the information of the member 'boxerpower' in Spain. That looks promising. Are there any other know rebuilds?

[Korbin Dallas]

Hello Haplo
Can you download the ride files off the usb under the seat?
There are posts on the forum to help with that. Then we can start to diagnose the issue.

[Korbin Dallas]

http://www.environ-systems.com/brammo-empulse-r.html

Here is the link to the log file converter. also lots of other good info that this member still has active

[Haplo]

Hi Korbin,.. Thanks for the link. I didn't found that one yet. I already found the USB stick in the Brammo. Will download the files and upload them here.

[EV promise]

Hi Bert, to answer your questions. Yes, if the  board relays temperature readings to the microprocessor in that module outside the parameters the B40 fault is displayed. A recent  .drv or .chg file from the data logger will reveal the module at fault as they contain alot of information. Data is recorded every 5 seconds.
Once opened, the file is saved as an Excel file for easy viewing.

[acceler]

I'm having the same issues with my bike 48
I bought bike 121 new in 17 and sold it back to polaris with the buyback program and regretted it. So when this 48 popped up on marketplaces I scooped it up.

Not new to ev by any means. I worked at 3 startup ev companies and am very familiar with. Sevcon and drive wizard. Have the software and the IXXXAT ADAPTOR that i program our size 4 sevcons with and know all the sevcon pinouts etc.

but this b40 has been the death of both these bikes.
I got the packs pulled. And trying to get guidance to what to do here.

So many question here. 🤔

I'm allready trickling the pack back up as they were sitting low. Bottom was at 42.25
Havnt touched top pack yet. One at a time.

First can someone sell me the diagnostic cable for the bms?

Also definitely not my first rodeo building batteries or configuration of sevcons and bms's. Just never mess with such and intergrated system and pouch cells. I know the sevcon can run independently so if I could actually log into the sevcon or trick the forwatd or safty switches in the someware I may just be able to build a new battery pack for it.

Well any help would be greatly appreciated as I really loved my 121 bike and would love to bring this 48 back to life.

[Brammofan]

Hi acceler. Where are you located? I just reached out to a guy who may have the cable you need. I thought he might have gotten rid of it, but I just asked him. I'll let you know.

[acceler]

Austin texas

[Brammofan]

Thanks. I'll let you know if I hear anything.

[Brammofan]

So, he doesn't have the cord anymore - sold it to the guy who bought his Empulse a few years ago.  He said that the cord only worked if you had the software and even then, you'd need some documents that he never had.

Sorry, friend.

[Korbin Dallas]

Are you looking for a cable to plug into the battery pack for BMS diagnostic?

[acceler]

Yes.
I've got batteries and sevcon experience just not fimualar with this brammo platform.
I need to be able to do diagnostics on the packs. Bought bike 48 and it only has 1400 miles on it.
Had bike 121 back in 2017to2019 and had the same b40 code.

[Haplo]

Too bad to hear you have the same issue aswell Acceler. And twice now if I understand correctly.. Feel bad for you. But good to have you here and seeing you are no newby to EV's.. There seem to be a lot of knowledge and experience gathering. We should be able to get somehwere.

I however got nowhere with the Log File Converter.. I downloaded the program OK, but it does not run. It gives the error that it misses some DLL file. Tried it on my win10 64x PC and my Win8 tablet. Both same error.

But I downloaded the files from the bike. I think I found the ones of the last succesfull ride, the charge after that and the ride that first gave the B40 i'm having now. Maybe someone else can convert it to CSV? I'm very curious what to find!

[acceler]

Yup 2nd empulse.
First one I bought new in2017 bike 121. Got 2 amazing years out of it then the dreaded b40 code of death after I washed it. Polaris bought it back for full price so i let it go. Then really missed it. Just found this one on marketplace 2 weeks ago and bought it. Back when 121 died  I was working at a high end electric scooter company that also service the gem golf carts so I got some experience with the sevcon software. The empulse uses a size 6 but we had the size 4 in our scoots. Still program the same. I just recently built an electric ruckus with a size 4 and did my our custom tune. I can tell you that it doesn't take much to make rhe sevcon stand alone. As long as victory hasn't password protected it. Or intergraded the can communication into thier vcu.  But I havnt try to log into it yet. Worst case I can build another batteries as that what I do now anyways. But would still prefer to fix the brammo packs since everything will work correctly instead of rewiring and reconfigure everything.

[acceler]

Man I really do hate the fule Size limited on these outdated forum platforms.