Hypothetical Solar Panel idea

[Durgenbold]

This is a post I made on the fb fanpage recently, directed as more of a production idea but it could be easily be thought of as a personal mod:

--Chris Haddlesey--

I've been a huge fan for half a year now, and I'm hoping to get a powercycle of my own as soon as I go off to college (I'm still a Junior), but for now I'm stuck rooting on the sidelines.

A few months ago, I sent the company an email suggesting the implementation of solar panels under the seat. Since cyclists usually ri...de on clear sunny days anyway, and commuters would keep it sitting in the parking lot all day, why not make the seat removable and put a solar panel under there for it to charge while you work? This could potentially double the possible distance for commuting, and could also serve as an anti-theft measure just like removing the seat of a bicycle. I think it's a good idea.

I told them I hope they use the idea since I think it's a good one and they deserve it, and it's not like I'm going to go out and make ebikes of my own or sue them for using it. All I asked from them was a response so I know they got it and maybe even some feedback, but I never heard from them...

What do you think? I'll be sure to join brammoforum.com and bring it up there. I hope the idea is realistically possible and it helps Brammo grow to become the company it deserves to be!

PS. Now, I realize this upgrade would be slot more involved than other mods (structural design, wiring, modification of battery intake) and if Brammo were really looking into it it would take time to find out how well it would work, but I at least want to now if the idea is feasible. If it is, I think it'd be worth the additional ... See Morecost since it'll improve the Enertia's distance on a charge, as well as introducing another feature to Brammo that would show its innovation. Any feedback is again welcome.

--Brammo Powercycles--

Chris, sorry we missed your email, please accept our apologies. You have some great ideas.The Enertia has a steering column lock and an immobilizer as standard so no need to carry the seat with you when parked. To charge the bike would require a much larger solar panel than we could squeeze under the seat. But solar panel technology is constantly changing so we better keep an eye on that one… see you on the Brammo forum soon I hope..

--Chris Haddlesey--

Yeah, one of my worries was how much energy the Enertia requires and whether or not a solar panel that size would be powerful enough to recharge its battery, even if left in a parking lot for the workday. I also thought of regenerating brakes but I know it's been addressed and I understand why it wouldn't be very benificial either. (because of how ... See Morelight the bikes are compared to cars) Anyway, I look forward to becoming more involved with the forums and fansites before I can become another lucky owner of a Brammobike.

Just throwing it out there for ya!

[ALephart]

I had this thought for awhile now. Rather then (solar panel+inverter+charger+battery) it would be better to find a solar panel setup that closes matches the native voltage of the battery pack and then have a charge controller directly hook to the battery.

Thoughts?

All the best,
Aaron Lephart

[Brammofan]

Believe it or not, my eight year old daughter had a similar idea... although her "panel" was more like an "umbrella."  I thought it was great (I'm the father of a genius) and I actually looked into whether it was possible.  I think I determined that, in order to charge the battery from near zero charge, to full charge, in approximately 8 hours, the umbrella would have to be about 75 feet in diameter and would cost about a gazillion dollars.

It's certainly possible that 1) my calculations were wrong and 2) that PV technology will advance to the point that the umbrella could be reduced to the size of one of those little ones that sit in your pina colada.

Just remember, charging the Enertia is free, at your workplace.

[Durgenbold]

Seems that everyone's been thinking the same thing! I haven't done any calculations about it but your conclusion sounds reasonable (or, unreasonable). My other idea was to put a small one somewhere on the bike (like on the overhang for the license plate) so it could constantly recharge while you bike, though I don't know if the constant charging and use of the energy would just wear the battery out since the charge couldn't be very significant anyway... Solar panels have been thought about since 1839, let's hope a breakthrough comes soon!

The only other ways I could think of alternative charging would be pedals (I saw them on scooters over in China) or maybe small windturbines on the side...

I suppose I'm getting a little redundant. Sticking to the grid seems to be the best option so far...

[enertia-ette]

My grand-daughter thinks that we should put a solar panel on the piece that sits right under the back brake light. She says that it is constantly exposed, even while you are riding. Leave it to the young people to figure this stuff out!
She also thinks that the bike should have a plug in for the iPhone and iPods. She says that because it is a charging system in itself, you should be able to charge everything at night together. Like a huge iPad...
Kids got a point!!!

[Durgenbold]

Not to revive this thread for 'bumping;' I think that the carport idea is perfect:

Uh-oh... you're really going to be on the hook now...

Here's the Enertia displayed with Sun Storage at the Portland Home and Garden show a couple of months ago. This company is keen to build somebody a solar carport they can charge from!  The aluminum extruded structure for this carport is produced by the same company that builds the Enertia frames in Portland. 

Removing the personal aspect of solar charging creates a perfectly feasible solution to the idea: merging the sparse charging-stations with wide-spread carports near apartments and other buildings. This idea could be huge. (Thanks for the find, Brian!)

[BrammoBrian]

Ok... so I have to admit that I know very little about the company providing this solar product.  Our service tech in Portland, Dave Murray, may have some additional information as he attended this show. It is a very cool idea though - although you'd need a bank of batteries to store the energy to charge your Enertia and you'd have to have somebody look at the voltage and current being generated by these panels to match it to the requirements to charge. Probably need an inverter as well to get the DC power converted to AC (which is what the Enertia's charger is designed to plug into). Here's a link to their website:

http://www.sunstorage.org/residential.html

[Brammowannabe]

Fyi, Solar for the enertia wont really work.  I'm a solar designer and i know how much these put out.  Lets make some assumtions.

4 kwh needed for a full charge
Location is PA. 
While at work you can somehow tilt the bike / pannel to optimal 30 degrres and face it due south
Your using SunPower 238's pannels wich are some of the most efficient pannels ont he market.

In july a 952 watt solar array would produce about 3.96 KWH on the average day (forget about driving home on the cloudy day)

That weighs about 140 pounds not includng a charge controler.  (the built in charger wont work with solar)  It takes up about 5' by 10' (how are you fitting that in you bramo).  Also in the winter it would only produce 1.9 KWH per day.

A solar pannel the size of the seat would add a lot of compexity and weight to the bike and offer almost no measurable benifit.  Set up a 1 or 2k solar arraay at home and charging you bike form it is a much better idea.

[FreepZ]

For that to work, you're going to need something like this:



http://www.twospoke.com/forum/f41/where-find-solar-powered-bicycle-2138/index2.html

This Guy did it with an electric Scooter. The PV panels fold up against the trunk on the back. You should be able to adapt his design to a bike with a larger hub motor.
He's been riding it for his (albeit) short commute and hasn't plugged it in since 2005.

That's a lot bigger than anything what could fit under the seat, and still pretty limited as to how much it can charge.

I hope that one day we will be able to run a house with a tiny PV panel, but we're a long way from that right now.

[protomech]

4x 30W panels. That's enough for maybe 700 wh/day during the summer here, at best. That'd power an enertia for 7-8 miles @ 35 mph, and a small scooter for maybe 12-15 miles @ 20 mph.

His commute was 5 miles each way.

[Brammowannabe]

Scooter= less power ussage, he probaly lives in a high irradiance area with a short commute.  Those are certainly not 238 pannels like mentioned in my last post.  Use pv watts to figgure out how much you could produce in a day.  Type in about .8 for the derate.  the math just doesn't work for a Brammo.