Author Topic: Mileage update....  (Read 11443 times)

FreepZ

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #30 on: May 01, 2012, 09:17:01 AM »
If I could make the 80 miles to mom's house (55-65 mph) [...] The Empulse MIGHT be able to make that trip.

I sure hope that it will be able to. That's pretty much what I plan to do with the Empulse. If nobody does it first, I plan to keep a log, like protomech has been keeping for the Zero, to document range and battery levels.

I'm not at all certain how well the Empulse will do at that range. Officially it can do 77 miles mixed, but "mixed" means half at 70 mph and half at 19 mph. The only place that I've ever driven at 19 mph on a road in Florida is in a school zone. As protomech says: It might be able to do 80 miles at 55 mph, but we will have to see. I hope that some kind person on this forum will be able to get some real world range/speed data for the bike.
Richard #935 #595 #44

protomech

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #31 on: May 01, 2012, 01:23:14 PM »
Just going by claimed ranges, the Empulse has about 29% more range at 70 mph, which is almost entirely dominated by aerodynamics (Empulse = 11.6 kW, S = 12.9 kW).

With rather arbitrary simulated parameters, at 55 mph the power requirements are lower and the ranges are higher. The Empulse has 25% more simulated range, eg Empulse = 6.45 kW / 79 miles and S = 6.75 kW / 63 miles.
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Gavin

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #32 on: May 02, 2012, 10:57:10 AM »
so i rode my bicycle in today...first ride of the year...gawd I felt slow...

luckily I will get faster fairly quick.

still I find myself finding reasons I need to take the Enertia....

tuesdays....can't get to the gym to make my class on my bicycle...can on the Enertia...so Tuesdays will not be bicycle days.

thursdays....see tuesday

This Friday I'm going to a 3:30 showing of The Avengers....need to take the Enertia for that.

So only one day this week on the bicycle...grrrr. kinda

Next week at least I should have monday, wednesday and friday...unless something comes up :)

Gavin

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #33 on: May 02, 2012, 11:27:39 AM »
It looks like my Enertia complaints will be:

1) More Range (at least for the next couple of updates)
2) Less cost (as with all things)
3) and that the Enertia is making me fat....

Gavin

Brammofan

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #34 on: May 02, 2012, 04:04:10 PM »
It looks like my Enertia complaints will be:
3) and that the Enertia is making me fat....
Okay protomech, time to pull out the calculator.  First, we need to figure out the "long tailpipe" of his Enertia.  Then, I would like to know how much energy it takes Gavin to ride his bicycle to work.  Your calculation, to be a fair comparison to the "long tailpipe" should include the amount of calories he will burn on his trip, the amount of energy used in order to plant the seeds that grew into the vegetables and fruits he ate, the amount of energy used to bring the animals that provide the meat he ate from birth to their maturity, the amount of energy to process these foods into the final product he ended up pulling off the shelf or out of the refrigerator and eating, the amount of energy to transport these foods from the field to the supermarket, the amount of energy used to refrigerate or freeze the foods, (am I forgetting something?) oh... the amount of water used to flush away the waste after his body had processed the foods.

Then - let's compare.  Enertias don't cause obesity. Inertia + too much food causes obesity
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protomech

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #35 on: May 02, 2012, 05:49:16 PM »
Well, it's easier to link to work other people have done : )

"Driving vs. Walking: Cows, Climate Change, and Choice", Michael Cohen and Matthew Heberger, Pacific Institute
http://www.pacinst.org/topics/integrity_of_science/case_studies/driving_vs_walking.pdf

The Pacific Institute study compares only the GHG emissions from the "fuel" energy inputs for walking, biking, driving a car. The summary on p.4 indicates that walking on a typical US diet generates about 25% of the GHG emissions as driving, and biking is about half that again. A vegan would generate about 20% of the GHG emissions as the typical US human-powered commuter.

A significant weakness in the PI study is that no consideration is given to the source of the food, which is a significant factor in the GHG emissions.


"Life Cycle Assessment of Transportation Options for Commuters", Shreya Dave, MIT
http://web.archive.org/web/20110715083534/http://www.pietzo.com/storage/downloads/Pietzo_LCAwhitepaper.pdf

Shreya Dave compares the GHG emissions for manufacture, disposal, and infrastructure required for use for walking, bikes, ebikes, automobiles, and various forms of public transit. Notably, she does not consider the GHG emissions from food production.

Quote
It has been assumed that, in the United States, a commuter will not change her eating habits if she
switches from driving to walking to work, given a reasonable walking distance and assuming sufficient
nutrition is available. (p.5) ... As with walking, food intake is assumed constant, and CO2 emissions are the additional CO2 release from the rider being at rest. (p.6)

Her summary, FWIW, is that walking, biking, and ebiking are responsible for the same amount of GHG emissions per mile. I haven't tried running numbers for an electric motorcycle, but it's probably about twice as emissive as an ebike.


Given that Gavin is gaining weight and thus presumably has not altered his diet downwards while riding the Enertia, Ms. Dave's assumption appears to hold true for him. In this case the Enertia likely is responsible for more GHG emission than his pedal bike.

In the eventual case where he reaches a steady weight and continues to bike, he will need to increase his diet to maintain his weight. Once the GHG emissions for his increased food consumption come into play, the pedal bike is probably no more efficient than the Enertia and possibly much less so.
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Brammofan

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #36 on: May 02, 2012, 06:00:27 PM »
Well, it's easier to link to work other people have done : )
I knew I could count on you.

Given that Gavin is gaining weight and thus presumably has not altered his diet downwards while riding the Enertia, Ms. Dave's assumption appears to hold true for him. In this case the Enertia likely is responsible for more GHG emission than his pedal bike.

In the eventual case where he reaches a steady weight and continues to bike, he will need to increase his diet to maintain his weight. Once the GHG emissions for his increased food consumption come into play, the pedal bike is probably no more efficient than the Enertia and possibly much less so.

But - aren't you forgetting: he gets a great deal of his electricity from solar panels?
 
And, of course, you are making assumptions that 1) he will reach a steady weight and 2) that he will continue to bike.

This is Gavin we're talking about.
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Gavin

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #37 on: May 02, 2012, 08:59:08 PM »
Wow!

I leave this site for a couple of hours to go see a movie, and this is what I come back too?!?!

For your information:

A) I rode my bicycle to the movies, 5 miles, took 20 minutes, so I can ride my bicycle on Friday and still hit the 3:30 Avergers...I probably couldn't get from the Hospital to Rio Century 24 any faster in a car. 15 miles on the bicycle for the first day of the season is not bad...will add many many miles before riding ends at Oct 1st.

B) Saw The Cabin in the Woods with a groups of friends and family...funny as hell...

C) While my weight will fluxuate 10-15 pounds from Winter to end of Summer, my diet doesn't. I basically live off Coke Zero and breakfast burritos...with PF Changs Kung Pao scallops every other Friday...
I'm not sure what emissions we are talking about, but see the above diet and make your assumptions.

D) There is no D

Gavin

protomech

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #38 on: May 17, 2012, 08:55:51 PM »
2000 miles on the Zero.



What can I say.. good excuse for pizza ; )

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Gavin

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #39 on: May 17, 2012, 10:08:25 PM »
NICE...

The loaner Enertia should hit 4k in about a week and a half...

You, my friend, are putting impressive miles on your Zero.

They are fun to drive.

Gavin

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #40 on: May 17, 2012, 11:01:12 PM »
Wow... 2000 miles and you havent been hit by a driver that could not hear you? Thats amazing! Really though, kinda jealous of you Gavin, Richard, and Harry... here I am with no motorcycle at all. First time in 5 years... I will have to put every mile I can on my Empulse to maximize my investment... Im pretty excited :). I hope Brammo can get me an Empulse this year, but I will have to get something either way.

Brammofan

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #41 on: May 17, 2012, 11:19:47 PM »
Wow... 2000 miles and you havent been hit by a driver that could not hear you? Thats amazing! Really though, kinda jealous of you Gavin, Richard, and Harry... here I am with no motorcycle at all. First time in 5 years... I will have to put every mile I can on my Empulse to maximize my investment... Im pretty excited :). I hope Brammo can get me an Empulse this year, but I will have to get something either way.
You, my friend, need to learn how to whine.  Lucky for you, you can learn at the feet of the master.  When the pupil is ready, the Gavin will appear.

Protomech - that's very cool that you've put 2K on the clock.
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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #42 on: May 18, 2012, 10:51:07 AM »
Wow... 2000 miles and you havent been hit by a driver that could not hear you? Thats amazing! Really though, kinda jealous of you Gavin, Richard, and Harry... here I am with no motorcycle at all. First time in 5 years... I will have to put every mile I can on my Empulse to maximize my investment... Im pretty excited :). I hope Brammo can get me an Empulse this year, but I will have to get something either way.
You, my friend, need to learn how to whine.  Lucky for you, you can learn at the feet of the master.  When the pupil is ready, the Gavin will appear.

Protomech - that's very cool that you've put 2K on the clock.

LOL, I dont know how to I guess... I have sent an email to empulse@brammo.com, and Gavin even supplemented that with another email. I have not gotten a response yet  :-\ So I still dont know if Brammo is willing to slip me a base Empulse, under the table. Even if i offer to disguise it with carbon fiber veneers.  ;D

protomech

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #43 on: May 18, 2012, 04:34:14 PM »
Wow... 2000 miles and you havent been hit by a driver that could not hear you? Thats amazing! Really though, kinda jealous of you Gavin, Richard, and Harry... here I am with no motorcycle at all. First time in 5 years... I will have to put every mile I can on my Empulse to maximize my investment... Im pretty excited :). I hope Brammo can get me an Empulse this year, but I will have to get something either way.

I will say that you need to be careful in parking lots. The bike is no quieter than a pedal bike, and it has more lighting, visual presence, and power to get out of the way of a reckless driver. But people don't expect pedal bikes in parking lots.

It is kind of useful for sneaking up on folks. I was out riding some mountain roads a couple weeks ago, came upon someone running in the middle of the road. Slowed down and paced him for a few minutes until he realized he wasn't alone : )

After riding the Zero, I can definitely say that the extra $3k for the Empulse is well-justified if it performs as it should and is as reliable as it should be. But a straight comparison between the two bikes is a little lopsided.. like comparing the 2009 Enertia Classic to the 2012 S, you can't compare them in the absence of that context.

The longer you wait to buy, the better and better the bikes get. The 2012 Zeros are better than the 2011, which were better than the 2010, which were (slightly) better than the 2009, etc. No doubt the 2013 will be better still. At some point you decide the bikes are good enough and jump in.. and the 2012 Zeros (in the absence information from Brammo) were that tipping point for me.

Someone asked a while back if I (or other Zero purchasers) regretted the Zero in light of the Empulse specs and reveal. Speaking for myself .. $14k for the S already required some serious soul-searching. $17k is an even steeper price, but the extra range & performance and getting the bike we've been waiting for nearly two years for .. would have ultimately clinched that decision. $19k is right out.

I'm thrilled by the Zero. And I'm much less angsty now (in case that wasn't obvious) .. buying in 2012 was right for me. I guess that's the best* answer to the question.

* if Brammo ends up shipping the regular Empulses this year, then I reserve the right to regret my decision : P
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Deadly Silent Ninja

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Re: Mileage update....
« Reply #44 on: May 18, 2012, 06:25:01 PM »
LOL, I dont know how to I guess... I have sent an email to empulse@brammo.com, and Gavin even supplemented that with another email. I have not gotten a response yet  :-\ So I still dont know if Brammo is willing to slip me a base Empulse, under the table. Even if i offer to disguise it with carbon fiber veneers.  ;D

C'mon, now! You have a blog named EMPULSEBUYER, of course you should qualify as "press" and get an Empulse R for free to "test drive" it until you can get your Empulse next year.  ;D