Author Topic: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle  (Read 1260 times)

sunchaser

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Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« on: January 22, 2021, 04:28:39 PM »
Just learned about the upcoming Sondors Metacycle that is scheduled to begin production late this year.  What do you think about this affordable electric motorcycle? 

https://sondorsx.com/pages/metacycle


Richard230

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2021, 05:22:14 PM »
I am not a big fan of ordering a motorcycle that doesn't exist yet and apparently has no retail dealers, especially if you have to pay a deposit to get on the waiting list. (Hello Lightning.)

I am still irritated about pre-ordering the original direct-drive Brammo Empulse in 2010 (if I recall correctly), which disappeared for a year or two when Brammo decided to install a gearbox in the bike. At least that pre-order deal didn't ask for a deposit.  I would have been quite happy with the original Empulse version, but when it was withdrawn, I went out and bought a 2012 Zero S from a local multi-brand dealer and have stuck with Zero ever since.
current bikes: 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2007 BMW R1200R, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

Shinysideup

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2021, 03:30:38 PM »
Pretty design (harsh seat?) and Sondors has been around a while.
But I'd wait until they are actually available. It's not like they're going to be whooshing out the door like Teslas.

Richard230

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2021, 08:58:41 AM »
Here is more news regarding the Sondors Metacycle. It looks like they will be coming to the market earlier than previously anticipated and are offering some nice options for the open space in the frame:   https://electrek.co/2021/07/18/closer-look-at-motor-behind-the-5000-sondors-metacycle-electric-motorcycle/
current bikes: 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2007 BMW R1200R, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

Ultratoad

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2021, 10:18:59 AM »
I am not a big fan of ordering a motorcycle that doesn't exist yet and apparently has no retail dealers, especially if you have to pay a deposit to get on the waiting list. (Hello Lightning.)

I am still irritated about pre-ordering the original direct-drive Brammo Empulse in 2010 (if I recall correctly), which disappeared for a year or two when Brammo decided to install a gearbox in the bike. At least that pre-order deal didn't ask for a deposit.  I would have been quite happy with the original Empulse version, but when it was withdrawn, I went out and bought a 2012 Zero S from a local multi-brand dealer and have stuck with Zero ever since.
Hell....  I'm still miffed about Polaris pulling the pin on the Victory Empulse TT after one season....

sunchaser

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2021, 11:46:24 AM »
Here's a recent story from Electrek about the Metacycle motor:

https://electrek.co/2021/07/18/closer-look-at-motor-behind-the-5000-sondors-metacycle-electric-motorcycle/#more-190238

Also, I watched a video from YouTuber trowan with some "insider" information regarding the Metacycle.  Be forewarned, the simulation portion of the video is a little sketchy.




I'm very curious to see some reviews on this bike too.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2021, 11:50:31 AM by sunchaser »

HadesOmega

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2021, 11:34:58 PM »
Hmm 14k puts it slightly more powerful than my modified Light Bee. For a $5k electric bike and it's intended purpose to to ride around town and occasionally hope on the freeway and exit or two I think it's still good.

Quote
The motor is designed to put out a max peak-rated power of 14 kW (20 hp), though ECO mode will presumably limit that power.

Look at this big hunk of motor
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sunchaser

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2021, 09:48:49 AM »
Your Light Bee must be pretty powerful with that kind of power to weight ratio. 

As for the Metacycle motor, it's manufactured by QS Motor in China.  Actually, most of the components for the Metacycle are made in China.  I've read a lot about the added unsprung weight of hub motors, but e-bikes and a few electric motorcycles like Evoke have been using them.  Not to mention the upcoming Aptera electric car/motorcycle and unlikely to be released Lordstown Endurance pickup.  If I remember correctly, the motor weighs about 50 pounds.  Hub motors can't be that bad, can they?  I would think that the cooling would be better considering that the motor is exposed and might have better airflow around it compared to a mid drive.

Not having to deal with chain maintenance would be great.  Adjusting, cleaning and lubing drive chains is a pain.


sunchaser

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2021, 09:54:56 AM »
I'm not expecting the parts quality of the Metacycle to be amazing, but at the price it's pretty reasonable for an electric motorcycle.  I also learned that a fair amount of the electrical components are available on Aliexpress.  Always good to have as many sources as possible for replacement parts.  Brammo probably didn't have the option of using off the shelf components because of the fact that electric motorcycles were still in their infancy.  Luckily things have changed in the last few years and now manufacturers have options to reduce the costs of their products.  The fewer proprietary parts the better in my opinion.  Make the bike simple and easy to repair.

HadesOmega

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2021, 04:48:49 PM »
Yeah Brammo one component goes wrong it spells doom for the whole system.  Lots of custom or proprietary stuff make it hard for normal people to troubleshoot.  My Light Bee is still running strong because the components are very simple.  Controller goes bad just replace it.  Battery goes bad just replace it.  All the battery components like the batteries and BMS are all contained in one unit.  Motor goes bad just replace it.  Not so simple on the Brammo, lots of complex computers and expensive components on it.

I just broke into the 16's with my Light Bee recently, it's pretty crazy because when I had the Empulse I was running 14s and 15s!


But yeah I would be interested in giving the Metacycle a try since it is so cheap.  Kinda sad they didn't have it at the recent International Motorcycle Show, they had the Livewire One.  I have yet to see a Metacycle in person.  But yeah I like the idea of the hub motor and not having to maintain a chain or belt.  I think it would be great to use as a delivery bike.  How well it cools the motor not sure will have to buy one and torture it on the race track haha.
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sunchaser

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2021, 09:32:24 AM »
Yes, the Brammo bikes are definitely complicated compared to some of the current e-bikes and e-motos.  It wouldn't be a big deal if the company was still in business and parts were available.  Too bad.  So much potential.

Thanks for sharing the video.  73 mph on a Light Bee?  That's crazy! 

I placed a reservation for the Metacycle.  Why not.  If the reviews are really bad on it I can always bail.  Estimated delivery is the first quarter of 2022.  I just can't justify paying $10k or more on an electric motorcycle.  I don't expect the range to be anywhere near 80 miles, but I'd be satisfied with 40-60 at that price.  There's also the option for the additional range extender battery.  No info on pricing for that or any of the other accessories like the passenger pegs, storage container, etc.

For those who are interested, most of the main electrical components for the bike are available on Aliexpress.  I think this is definitely a good thing.  Doesn't hurt to have options for replacement parts.  From what I can tell.  It looks like Sondors worked with QS Motors and its subsidiaries to handle some of the design work for the bike. 

The Metacycle is going to have reverse, eco and sport modes, and locking brakes.

Richard230

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2021, 04:36:22 PM »
Where can you purchase the Sondors Metacycle? Will they be sold in established motorcycle shops?
current bikes: 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2007 BMW R1200R, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

sunchaser

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2021, 06:24:50 PM »
I believe that all of their products are sold direct online.  The Metacycle will show up at your door in a large crate.  Some assembly required I'm sure.  It would be great to have a large network of established motorcycle dealers for parts and support, but that isn't the case with the Metacycle.  I've owned my Brammo Enertia for about two years (still love the bike) without any official parts or support, so I'm fine with online support and parts ordering.  The idea of doing my own repairs on the Metacycle doesn't worry me, but I can definitely understand how others would be concerned about the lack of dealer support.  Sondors claims that those who aren't mechanically inclined can take the bike to a shop of their choosing.  That's assuming that the shop is willing to perform the work.  We'll have to see how this plays out.

From what I've learned about the Sondors bike, they're using  a fair amount of off the shelf electrical components and other parts.  As I mentioned in my previous post, most of the electrical bits like the motor, controller, display, switches, etc. can be ordered from other online retailers.  It appears that the  Metacycle was designed to be relatively simple (modular) in order to reduce cost and repair complexity.  Less is more in my opinion, like the single piece cast aluminum frame.  Clever engineering.

Time will tell how good or bad the bike is going to be.  First deliveries are scheduled for this quarter.  Either way, more competition in the electric motorcycle space will be good for consumers. 

Richard230

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2021, 07:12:09 PM »
The first issue for Sondors is that they will have to obtain a DMV vehicle retail permit from every state that they will do business in. And of course, the purchaser will have to visit their state DMV to register the vehicle and pay licensing fees. Something of a hassle, depending upon the state. Also, someone is going to have to pay the local sales tax in communities that have such a tax, like mine which is 9.75% of the purchase and shipping cost. Typically the seller will have to pay that tax and add that to the purchase price. Selling vehicles via the internet can be done, but it does have legal and regulatory complications that will have to be worked out by Sondors.

Even H-D seems reluctant to sell the LiveWire One by shipping directly it to the customer's home. It sounds to me like they want the buyer to visit a local retail outlet in the three states where they will be selling the bike to pick up their vehicle as they are limiting the sale of the bike to within 50 miles customer from the shop.   ???
« Last Edit: July 21, 2021, 07:19:50 PM by Richard230 »
current bikes: 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2007 BMW R1200R, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

HadesOmega

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Re: Sondors $5000 Metacycle electric motorcycle
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2021, 08:40:18 PM »
I don't think it's a big deal to sell it directly.  Look at CSC they ship all their bikes unless you can pick it up in Azusa, California.  Its not something new. 

Its good you can get the parts on AliExpress the only problem with that is most of the stores are in China and well shipping from China can take forever I recently built a battery bank for my hybrid offgrid solar system and it too like 3 months to get the batteries.  Hopefully sondors will have parts readily available in the the states.  Same problem with the Sur Ron you can get parts but they have to shipped overseas in giant container so it takes a while for Luna Cycle to get them, in some cases Luna Cycle started making parts for the Light Bee.

But yeah I'm lookin at getting another electric bike in the future it's either the Storm Bee, Metacycle, or Eva9 SS+ will  have to see what happens next year.

I noticed they moved the release date from October to early 2022.  I guess they were too optimistic about the October release.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2021, 09:19:16 PM by HadesOmega »
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