Bike not turning off

[elainachambers]

The problem first began when the bike would not fully power down, meaning that motor would turn off but the accessories (headlight and display) were remaining powered on.  These accessories remained powered on even after the ignition key was turned to off and removed from the ignition switch. Interestingly, the bike's motor could still be turned on normally, by putting the key in the ignition switch and powering the bike on. This problem began suddenly. I rode my bike to an event and upon arrival, the accessories would not power off.  I left the bike like this for about two hours in the driveway and then rode home nothing out of the ordinary. Once I returned home, the accessories would still not power down. Not knowing what else to do, I let the bike sit with accessories on overnight. The next morning the battery was dead and the motor would no longer power on. At this time the display and headlight, though dim, were still on. So the batteries had some power.  I tried to charge the bike but to no avail.  The bike was not recognizing the charger connection. I had the bike towed to a local shop.  I told them I thought it was a faulty ignition switch.  Several days later they informed me they tested the ignition switch, that it was not the problem, but they were not sure what the problem was. By this time the bike batteries had totally died, and the problem remained undiagnosed.

I then took the bike back home, having it towed again.  I tried to externally charge the battery modules externally as suggested here: http://brammoforum.com/index.php?topic=3547.msg25283#msg25283 First I tried charging the battery powering the AC Converter.  But there was no response when the charger was connected. When that didn't work I charged every battery module individually, and yes it took a couple of days.  The battery cells were tested with a voltmeter, and they were charged, but the bike refused to power on, the display was blank and completely unresponsive to turning the key.

I have downloaded and installed the Brammo Empulse Log Inspector v1.03 and loaded the log files but have no clue how to read it. I have tried numerous shops in San Jose, CA with no luck. They all say they don’t work on the brand. Any help or advice is appreciated. 

[siai47]

Not an expert at all about this but----  If I had a problem that wouldn't allow the bike to power down, I would use the high voltage interlock (located near the front forks under the fairing) to shut it down and then wait for a couple of hours and re-connect it.  This might clear something "stuck" in one of the computers and clear the problem.  If it powers back up with the key "off" then see if the bike can be driven.  If it can't try turning on the key and see if you get a "ready" indication and if it drives.  This would tell you that the main contactor is working and not stuck (should see a code with that one anyway.  If it still won't power off it is most likely a VCM problem and you are stumbling around in the dark without diagnostic software.   I believe there is a small memory battery in the VCM that could also keep it alive.  To clear codes (or something latched) without diagnostic software that is as far as I can take you. 

Before you start doing anything, open the interlock first and close it last.  There are some pictures of the VCM taken apart on this forum so you can see where the battery is.  It should be replaced anyway as I think this is what is also used to keep the dash clock running along with other things when the interlock is open.  Good luck--I feel like the blind leading the blind on this one and hope some else with more knowledge on this might chime in.

[HadesOmega]

That's what I was thinking also disconnect the main safety plug.  I've never done it but it is on the right side of the bike near the steering.

[empulsefan]

Hello,

 i've been reading the wiki and found this about a reboot?
http://www.brammoforum.com/wiki/index.php?title=Behavior_with_a_low_state_of_charge

perhaps this will help!

good luck!

[elainachambers]

Siai47 -

Not an expert at all about this but----  If I had a problem that wouldn't allow the bike to power down, I would use the high voltage interlock (located near the front forks under the fairing) to shut it down and then wait for a couple of hours and re-connect it.  This might clear something "stuck" in one of the computers and clear the problem.  If it powers back up with the key "off" then see if the bike can be driven.  If it can't try turning on the key and see if you get a "ready" indication and if it drives.  This would tell you that the main contactor is working and not stuck (should see a code with that one anyway.  If it still won't power off it is most likely a VCM problem and you are stumbling around in the dark without diagnostic software.   I believe there is a small memory battery in the VCM that could also keep it alive.  To clear codes (or something latched) without diagnostic software that is as far as I can take you. 

Before you start doing anything, open the interlock first and close it last.  There are some pictures of the VCM taken apart on this forum so you can see where the battery is.  It should be replaced anyway as I think this is what is also used to keep the dash clock running along with other things when the interlock is open.  Good luck--I feel like the blind leading the blind on this one and hope some else with more knowledge on this might chime in.

This probably would have worked, before the bike died completely.  Since the batteries drained, I did disconnect the voltage completely (the blue button located at the forks). Charge the batteries with a trickle charger, test with voltmeter, and re-hook-up everything- but no success.

[elainachambers]

Hello,

 i've been reading the wiki and found this about a reboot?
http://www.brammoforum.com/wiki/index.php?title=Behavior_with_a_low_state_of_charge

perhaps this will help!

good luck!

From what I can tell, this only has to do with how the bike functions and discharge when the battery is getting low, not once it has completely died.  I suspect the problem is that the DC converter isn't getting the power it needs to charge; not sure though.

[siai47]

It would take a heck of a trickle charger to charge the traction batteries up to a level that the BMS will allow a restart of the DC-DC converter and then the bikes battery charger.  You need to find out what the voltage of the traction battery is.  If the individual cells drop much below 2.75 volts you are near a point that you will "brick" the pack making it forever unusable.  You need to get the pack up to about 100 volts DC and then see what is going on.  You never want any group of cells to exceed 4 volts.  You may have to remove the pack and get into the battery modules to monitor the voltage as you charge as the cell balancer system will be inoperative while you charge it externally.  It's a lot of work and if you A: don't have a service manual, B: don't have access to a charger that can reach the voltages you need or C: don't feel comfortable doing this kind of work then you need to find someone who can help you.  You can cheat a bit if you can get the modules opened up.  If you took a regular 12 volt automotive battery charger and connected four of the battery cell groups together, you could get the group into a safe range without over charging the group.  Four groups in series could be charged to 16 volts (or however high the 12 volt battery charger will go without exceeding 16 volts) without damage.  You would need to monitor each cells in the four cell groups and stop the charge when any group reaches 4 volts DC.  Then you need to move on to the next four cell groups and do the same thing until all cells are charged.  That is most likely the only way you are going to save the pack with limited resources.  If, when you start this, you find any groups of cells below around 2 volts, don't even try it. The battery is bricked.  In addition, do not do any of this indoors.  If something goes wrong, these things can burn.  Do all the work outdoors away from anything flammable.  Check the voltage often and make sure the cells are not getting hot.  Have a hose handy if something really bad happens to keep the battery cool while it bleeds off it's charge. Have a tub nearby to toss it into and leave it there for a couple of days until you have zero terminal voltage before getting rid of the battery.  Hope you can save it, if not, its still a pretty bike and would make great wall art in your house  .   

[littlebrother]

My brother had the same problem (bike not turning off) on his Brammo Empulse and I was able to fix it.
This may come too late for you but maybe it helps someone else.

Overview: the Brammo's low-voltage electronics is supplied via a DC-DC converter from the HV battery. The high voltage is fed to this DC-DC via a semiconductor switch (FET) inside the VCU.
For a FET, it is common that its failure results in a short circuit.

To fix this problem, I opened the VCU and replaced the FET. It is driven by an optocoupler that was still working but to be sure, I also replaced this part.

The part numbers of the two components are the following:
FET: IRFS4127
Optocoupler: APV1121S

To get it fixed, you need to get the parts and find someone who has a bit of experience with soldering. Maybe you have a chance in a repair cafe or hackerspace.

[elainachambers]

Awesome! Thank you!
I was able to get the bike to charge enough that the display comes on. Still won't fully power on though, gave both an A6 and B6 error, so your advice seems like a good solution.

[littlebrother]

Good to hear that you did not scrap the motorcycle in the meantime.

Always be careful with the battery voltage.
Once removed, opening the VCU and replacing the parts should not be too difficult. You need to find someone with a good soldering station and this person will also know where to get the replacement parts (which were cheap).

Let me know if you need additional information.

Good luck with getting the bike going again!