Guess the Specs....April 18th will decide the winner...

[Gavin]

On April 18th we will announce full specifications

Ok, so we now know that specs are coming on the 18th....A Wednesday...

And the full reveal will be May 8th...A Tuesday...just to throw us off...

So what is your guess of the final specs

HP
Weight
Top speed
Battery pack
Price...

etc etc

Gavin

[Deadly Silent Ninja]

I don't really know about the specs, but by the way they are talking in the video, they should be better than Zero's and better than last year's specs.

The price tag is the one worrying me a little bit, but I hope there will either be a cheaper option and/or a very nice payment plan...

[00049 (AKA SopFu)]

I heard there is going to be a factory NOS option.

 

I think they'll stick close to the original specs:
40KW (60HP)
~430lbs for the 10 (transmission will compensate for any battery weight savings).
Top speed will be advertised at 100, but I'd be willing to bet with gearing it would do 115.
and I am going with $17k for the 10.

[Gavin]

74 HP
467 pounds for the 8 battery pack 10
447 pounds for the 6 battery pack 7.5 (maybe)

Top speed will be posted as 100+.  (maybe 110+ if Brammo feels cocky)

16499 for the 10

14499 for the 7.5

All just guesses

Gavin


Ps....isn't Brammo making electric racebikes for the ttx series?

Maybe a fairing will be an option on the street version to mimic the racebike look.

[protomech]

I think Brammo will offer a 5 module Empulse 6.7 kWh and a 7 module 9.3 kWh.

We know Enertia Plus is $11k at 6.2 kWh.

I'm guessing the extra hardware (liquid cooling, IET, 3 kW charger, bigger/stickier tires) will add around $3000 to the bike cost. Most of that is in the IET and bigger motor. Add $500 for the extra cells gets us to $14500.

Zero's battery pack upgrade (5.3 -> 7.9 kWh) is $2500, so let's say Brammo's pricing is the same (6.7 -> 9.3 kWh = +$2500).

Then we have Brammo's bikes:
$8k Enertia 3.1 kWh (not sure how they're going to pull this off .. 44v 70Ah?)
$11k Enertia Plus 6.2 kWh
$14.5k Empulse 6.7 kWh
$17k Empulse 9.3 kWh

Brammo wasn't super-aggressive with the Enertia Plus pricing, I don't expect them to be very aggressive here. The Empulse is a premium bike and is priced accordingly .. note that I'm basically keeping the same pricing as my earlier guess.

And the competition:
$7.7k Zero XU ZF3 2.6 kWh
$11.5k Zero S/DS ZF6 5.3 kWh
$14k Zero S/DS ZF9 7.9 kWh

Final production reveal in May, I assume we'll see the preorder confirmations going out around that time as well. That puts first deliveries in August, assuming they stick with their schedule.

Assuming Brammo delivers an Empulse 9.3 kWh for $17k in August, Hollywood Electrics will be right in a way. Brammo isn't delivering the 10 kWh $14k bike they were talking about in July 2010. But it surely will ship, and it's going to rock people's socks when it arrives.

[Gavin]

Still think they will go 6 and 8...so they can be over 10 kWh on the top model...

But disagreeing with Proto is usually a losing position to take.

And if the top Zero is 7.9 kWh, then 9.3 for the Empulse would be a significant amount more..

Though, as I've said before, the Empulse and the S are not really direct competitors...very different bikes...


All this is really quite fun...can't wait to see the final reveal.

The real question is...will it be insanely cool enough to make me move "up" from the Plus?

Gavin

[protomech]

But disagreeing with Proto is usually a losing position to take.

I disagree with myself all the time. I'd love to be proven wrong on the pricing, btw - I've tried to be somewhat conservative, so I hope if I'm wrong it's because Brammo came in a thousand bucks under my guess.

The real question is...will it be insanely cool enough to make me move "up" from the Plus?

As a commuter bike, I think the Enertia Plus and S are fine. The Empulse will be available with a larger battery pack, two-up riding, and faster charging, which are all fine and good .. but at a significant cost. $6000 spread between the Enertia+ and a hypothetical Empulse 9.3.

The two-up riding and the Empulse looks are gating factors, if you gotta have either then the Enertia+ drops out of consideration. Similarly, the performance from the transmission or the unproven reliability can be gating factors as well.

Otherwise, take a look at what your real range needs - go ahead, log your travel for a few weeks (include trips you would have taken if cost in a gas vehicle or range were a non-issue) .. and then determine whether the Empulse would allow you to make longer or more frequent trips, and how much that extra range is worth to you.

Most of my trips would be well-served by the ZF6 Zero (or the Enertia+, I generally still avoid the freeway anyhow). I do enjoy the extra speed from the Zero (and I'd love the looks of the Empulse) .. but I sometimes wonder if the Enertia+ or the ZF6 bike would have been a better fit for me.

[Richard230]

My guess is that there will be only one version of the Empulse at first. It will be a top-specification model and its cost will be $18,000. This is based upon my experience at being a motorcycle customer that has bought 42 bikes over the past 50 years and I think I am getting a feel for pricing by now.  I'll leave the spec and performance guessing to everyone else.   

[Gavin]

As a commuter bike, I think the Enertia Plus and S are fine. The Empulse will be available with a larger battery pack, two-up riding, and faster charging, which are all fine and good .. but at a significant cost. $6000 spread between the Enertia+ and a hypothetical Empulse 9.3.

The two-up riding and the Empulse looks are gating factors, if you gotta have either then the Enertia+ drops out of consideration. Similarly, the performance from the transmission or the unproven reliability can be gating factors as well.

Oh for me it is the perfect being the enemy of the good...

The Plus will be great for me...no problems with commuting, no problems with my shorter weekend rides...I like the ride and the looks and the feel of it.

But I would "like" 2 up riding. It would make the Plus "perfect" (well that and 500 miles of range...but that is for next decade)...

The thing is I rarely ride 2-up...so it is not a deal killer...but it would have been nice.

Now the Empulse isn't my favorite style...but the teaser image looks promising...and 2-up and faster and long range are all "pluses"...but I really wanted to keep the bike below 10k...that isn't going to happen...but over 15K is just too big a jump for my needs (commuting, weekend fun).

My wife does have a helmet...and she has ridden with me a couple of times...but I don't know how often I would ride with her anyways...the last time we road together I leaned a bit into a turn (I usually take the turns like I have training wheels on when she rides with me)...not even that deep...I got a rap on the helmet and she leaned forward and said, "Don't EVER do that again."

But more reason for Brammo to make me a side car for the bike

Gavin

[EmpulseRider]

Im guessing there will be 2 models available to retain 6.0, 8.0, and even the 10.0 preorder customers. Protomech knows what he is talking about so im going to go with his predictions on battery configurations, capacities will be 6.7 and 9.3 with 5 and 7 battery modules. Im guessing HP will be around 65hp with around 75lb/ft of torque. Top speed will be 120ish. Price will be 12995 and 15995... which will be within parity range of high end midsize ICE bikes. That may be wishful thinking but Brammo has claimed before that parity with ICE bikes is the goal... The Empulse will be "off the hook" but, lets not be too cocky with pricing. Hopefully both models will be available at launch too, I wont be able to buy a 16k+ bike, period.

[Gavin]

Oh...and faster charging...Not something I need on a daily basis...I usually either charge while at work (plenty of time) or at home over night (plenty of time)...

But on weekend rides out of town for lunch and fun, well getting twice the charge over an hour stop would be sweet.

I, not to make empulsebuyer mad, don't know if Brammo can make the Empulse at 12995...

If the Plus is 10995, well that would only be 2k for water cooling, bigger motor, improved components (thicker metal, bigger tires, bigger brakes etc etc...all the parts needed to keep a bike safe at 100 plus mph), fancier batteries and faster charging...well all that sounds like more than 2k to me...

Gavin

[machone]

My guesses(just that):

72bhp
478lb
118mph
9.1kwh
16999usd

Just over a week to go until we know!

[protomech]

If they use 8 BPM 15/90 modules then they'll have a capacity of 10.7 kWh, which will be easier to justify a 100 mile real world range. (I get 65-70 miles from the 7.9 kWh ZF9, and a 10.7 kWh Empulse would have 35% more capacity). $18k would be an appropriate price for that configuration - expensive, but far more range than Zero's bikes.

It costs Brammo very little to make a model with fewer battery packs - in fact, there would be little reason to make the pack modular otherwise. I strongly suspect they will have a low-end model; they're going to lose a LOT of customers if the entry price jumps from $10k to $18k.

What if they took a more granular approach?

$13k base price with 4 modules = 5.3 kWh. Same capacity as Zero ZF6 and less capacity than Enertia Plus, more performance than both.
$1250 per extra 1.33 kWh module, up to a total of 8 modules. $18k fully populated @ 10.7 kWh.

Strongly recommend that you buy the batteries all at once, but you COULD buy the $13k bike initially, and then add more batteries in six months or a year as needed.

The smaller modules also will make the battery pack easier to swap out - each module should be < 20 lbs.

40 kW / 54 hp continuous
120 mph top speed
0-60 in 5s
9.3 kWh / 440 lbs

[Gavin]

$13k base price with 4 modules = 5.3 kWh. Same capacity as Zero ZF6 and less capacity than Enertia Plus, more performance than both.
$1250 per extra 1.33 kWh module, up to a total of 8 modules. $18k fully populated @ 10.7 kWh.

You, my friend, are a genius...

That would be perfect, and silly for Brammo not to do (unless the controller has issues with various configurations...unlikely)

What would be the range of a 5.3 kWh Empulse?

configs could be 4,6,8 packs=13K, 15.5k and 18K....a fair range of prices...50miles, 75 miles and 100 miles...a fair range of distance (though 50 miles would be less than most want...you would burn through your electrons very fast at 100mph with a 5.3 kWh pack pushing that Empulse)

Gavin

[EmpulseRider]

If they use 8 BPM 15/90 modules then they'll have a capacity of 10.7 kWh, which will be easier to justify a 100 mile real world range. (I get 65-70 miles from the 7.9 kWh ZF9, and a 10.7 kWh Empulse would have 35% more capacity). $18k would be an appropriate price for that configuration - expensive, but far more range than Zero's bikes.

It costs Brammo very little to make a model with fewer battery packs - in fact, there would be little reason to make the pack modular otherwise. I strongly suspect they will have a low-end model; they're going to lose a LOT of customers if the entry price jumps from $10k to $18k.

What if they took a more granular approach?

$13k base price with 4 modules = 5.3 kWh. Same capacity as Zero ZF6 and less capacity than Enertia Plus, more performance than both.
$1250 per extra 1.33 kWh module, up to a total of 8 modules. $18k fully populated @ 10.7 kWh.

Strongly recommend that you buy the batteries all at once, but you COULD buy the $13k bike initially, and then add more batteries in six months or a year as needed.

The smaller modules also will make the battery pack easier to swap out - each module should be < 20 lbs.

40 kW / 54 hp continuous
120 mph top speed
0-60 in 5s
9.3 kWh / 440 lbs

I really hope Brammo considered this route, because that would be genius. People could buy now, and upgrade later too! Thats what I would do because my wife wont allow me to spend over 14k... maybe 15k, but <14k would be much easier to work with for me. I hope Brammo is listening... I wonder if they would just pop in dummy modules to take up empty compartments...