Enertia 2.0 speculation...timing...

[Gavin]

Will we see this rumored Enertia 2.0, Enertia Plus, Enertia EX

A) Before the Empulse
B) After the Empulse
C) At the same time as the Empulse
D) What's an Enertia Plus?

Gavin

[Gavin]

My guess is this...

The changes will be fairly minimal. A bit more battery, a bit better battery management...maybe water cooling. And some new colors.

So it isn't a total reboot like the Empulse. Less testing and parts and such...

So Enertia 2.0 in Spring (April? Would love sooner, but can deal with April )
And Empulse 1.0 in Summer.

All just guesses.

Gavin

[protomech]

If it uses the same battery tech as the Empulse, then probably around the same time. Maybe a little after to maximize the impact of the Empulse. (hm, impact => Empact?)

Also interesting to me: will Empulse and Enertia 2.0 feature assemblies manufactured by Flextronics, or will the initial release of the bikes be built by Brammo?

[Gavin]

I don't think the next Enertia is getting the Empulse pack...though I could be wrong.

It would be great if it did....The Enertia with a 6 or even 8 pack would be outstanding. 8 would be hard to fit....6 shouldn't be too hard if you widen the very narrow Enertia by a couple of inches.

But I see them doing a bit of a reboot of the Enertia pack...a bit more density, a bit better management, a bit bigger (3.1 to 4...maybe 5, but that would be hard to do without increasing bike width--though as I said, making the Enertia a inch or two wider in the pack area would be fine)...Then a couple of other small changes and boom, Enertia plus that goes farther and a bit faster (60 miles range, 70 or 75 mph top speed), but almost exactly the same bike. Still made in house for the next six month to a year.

Of course all guesses, and wild ones at that....and partially because I agree that if they use the same pack that the Enertia might come out later than the Empulse...and I would like it to come sooner

Gavin

[protomech]

Alright, trying to figure out if I'm going mad, or someone's playing a game : )

We used to have a thread with speculation as to the next Enertia's name. Enertia 2.0, Enertia Plus, etc? That thread seems to be gone, or it only existed in my imagination.. can't find it.

Also, someone's blog had posted about the Brammo Enertia Plus straight from the horse's mouth: following a trip to Brammo HQ and what seemed like official confirmation directly from Brammo to them. That blog post is now.. gone : )

I rushed to the intertubes when I read that blog post, but saw noone else mentioning the new bike. So either they were outrageously fibbing, or they pulled the post possibly after realizing it was too early .. or as mentioned earlier, I'm going mad!

Edit: I'm not mad. My RSS reader cached the post. So there you go, third-hand confirmation that the Enertia Plus is on its way.. and perhaps sooner rather than later.. maybe it'll even be the last surprise revealed in September. Tick tock tick tock ..

[Brammofan]

Dispatch two black helicopters to protomech's location.  Stat.

[Phantom]

Dispatch two black helicopters to protomech's location.  Stat.

Two lawn darts dispatched. We have the package. Over.

[Brammofan]

So, to get back to the matter at hand... I'd like to know your thoughts about how an increase in range equates to value.

1.  If the Enertia 2.0 (or whatever it's called) could go 60 miles on a charge, how much would you pay (assuming the current model's pricing - 42 miles for $7995)?

2.  If the Enertia 2.0 could go 80 miles on a charge, how much would you pay?

and, what the heck... let's go for all the marbles...

3.  If the Enertia 2.0 could go 100 miles on a charge, how much would you pay?

Let's discuss...

[Phantom]

If I did not alrerady own the 42 mile version and Brammo's pricing for the Empulse is ignored:

1) $8,995
2) $9,495
3) $9,995

I hit a price ceiling just shy of 10K. 

[protomech]

Keep in mind that a 6.0 kwh battery is likely to give double the range (or maybe a bit more or a bit less) of a 3.0 kwh battery. So if you're getting 40 miles on an enertia 1, you're looking at more like 80 on an enertia 6.0.

[EmpulseRider]

I really suck at speculation and predicting Brammo's next move has proved difficult but im gonna throw in my 2 cents in anyway. So here is my crappy prediction:

Brammo will lower the price on the Enertia to 6995 and will offer a plus version for 7995 with a range of about 60 miles and a top speed somewhere around 75. That's my guess.

[Gavin]

Empulsebuyer, I would jump on that with both feet and whatever other feet I could find:)

60 miles and 75 mph for 8k would rock

For me is more than just range...I want 75 mph too

So....60 range and 75 top speed...7995 would be great, but likely 8495 or 8995.
80 range and 75 top speed...8995 would be great, but maybe 9495, but more likely 9995.
100 range and 75 top speed...don't think they can get enough batteries in the enertia for that without a huge over haul...but if they could it would priced  be in Empulse 8.0 price area...

A lot depends on the pack... If they got Empulse 6 and 8 in the enertia, well mass battery buys will help costs, but the enertia would need major over hauls to rock those batteries.

If they can get increased speed and range from battery improvements while keeping the pack size at 4 and 5, well that will save money because there won't be an major upgrades to body and structure.

Gavin

[HighlanderMWC]

assuming the current model's pricing - 42 miles for $7995

Is anybody getting anywhere near that range?

[protomech]

A lot depends on the pack... If they got Empulse 6 and 8 in the enertia, well mass battery buys will help costs, but the enertia would need major over hauls to rock those batteries.

If they can get increased speed and range from battery improvements while keeping the pack size at 4 and 5, well that will save money because there won't be an major upgrades to body and structure.

6 Valence U1-12XP packs in the Enertia weigh approximately 39kg, total capacity of 3.1kwh. Total volume is 28L.

Leyden Energy claims their lithium batteries (to be used in the Empulse) have 225 wh/kg specific energy, 400 wh/L energy density. A 6.0 kwh pack would then weigh 27 kg for the cells + whatever for packaging. When packaged, you're probably looking at around 30L.

The LE cells have some magical numbers attached to them.

[Brammofan]

assuming the current model's pricing - 42 miles for $7995

Is anybody getting anywhere near that range?

I am getting "near" that range, and I tend to attribute the shortfall to my height (6'3") and weight (210 lbs.).  The times when I've dared to take my bike close to 0% and have driven at average speeds at or below 35 mph, I have been able to get 33-37 miles in range.